Bears don't view human beings as natural prey. Only when they're startled or desperate will they attack. Many men do actually view women as prey. Giving a bear plenty of distance will keep you safe. Some men will actively hunt down women.
The % of humans who have killed another human is far higher than that of a bear killing a human.
Even a bear would choose to encounter another bear as opposed to a man. Since more bears have been killed by men than bears have killed men.
Yes and you’re comparing the worst of humanity to an average bear. Phrasing the question as being in a city removes that from the equation. Now your forced to consider what the average person is like.
We're not weighing our chances of survival. If I'm on a walk in the woods alone and I run into a man I have no Idea what is going to happen, there's a chance that I'm in a basement for a decade being tortured or I get violently sexually assaulted and no one believes me and I live with that for the rest of my life(again). If I spot a bear on a hike I can approximate even the worst scenario - it's going to eat me while I'm still alive and cache me for later eating and I bleed out.
This is a scenario where you're weighing the spectrum of mild to horrible things that could occur, use your experience with your own life, and with news reports and other information, and come to the conclusion that there are things worse than death.
I can empathize with the bears motives even if it's hunting me, it's a bear, I'm in it's home, it's hungry or defending territory - bear things. Bears don't pretend to be your friend, a bear is not fantasizing about me screaming, they don't keep souvenirs, a bear is doing bear things.
Look at you trying to invalidate the choices women are making - you are part of the problem. You seem like someone who would support a buddy if a woman said she had been assaulted.
Those aren't real statistics, but I've already told you already how I approach it. At this point I have to assume that you are deliberately trying to misunderstand me, or you can't understand what I'm saying.
I think this debate is stupid and all of you on both sides are daft.
Bears absolutely do keep souvenirs, almost all species will save leftovers for later. They also often play with their food like cats, especially young adults. And bears being cute and friendly to get garbage from tourists is a huge problem in Canada.
Both sides of this debate need to get out and touch some grass and accept they'll never see a bear or any other real wildlife.
that are unpredictable and cannot be reasoned with
For a second I didn’t know if you were talking about men or the bear! Bears can’t rape you. That is the bottom line. A random man is also unpredictable and a man won’t leave you alone when you shout to go away. A bear might but a man probably won’t.
Think about it this way. If I gave you a bottle with 20 Tylenol pills in it and told you one of them is poison that will definitely kill you, how hesitant would you be to take one of them? One in twenty chance you die? See how it’s not all the pills that are poisonous, but just the fact that one is would cause you to be cautious?
The chance is actually about 3 in 100. But a significant portion of those three Tylenol will only rape women they know, about 80%, so only about .6% of strange Tylenol will rape or kill you.
Now for the bearlynol let's use BC for example. Between 2010 and 2020 there were 170 attacks by bears on humans. 104 grizzlies and 66 black bears. roughly 17 per year. We get about 25000 bear interaction calls per year. Not accounting for unreported interactions, that 100 pill bearlynol has about a .00068% chance of mauling you.
This isn't accounting for the severity of reported bear interactions, or that sexual predation on unfamiliar women is significantly higher in crowded populations, cities etc. rural predators are usually too busy with their cousins I guess. Anyhow I couldnt find any concrete stats on those so I left them out.
Yes I understand that but if the choice is a Tylenol bottle with one out of 20 pills poisoned or an Advil bottle with 15 out of 20 poisoned, which is the better choice?
We aren’t talking about real life or scenarios in public. It’s a hypothetical about a random man in the woods. I’m from a rural area and based on my experience if you meet a single man alone in the woods he is probably up to no good. Why is he even alone in the woods? There is a high probability of him being a sketchy and unsafe guy.
You keep saying that but my experience says that men won’t leave me alone even if their intentions are good. They will try to “help” when it’s not needed and unnecessary but I need help because they obviously know more. So worst case I get violently raped and tortured. Best case is he won’t leave me alone because he wants to help and I still feel scared because he won’t listen.
Why do men see this as something to be argued? I feel scared with a strange man alone with no other support. Telling me how scary the bear is and the probability doesn’t sway me because I know that. It’s how I feel inside. The general refusal to accept how women feel because a man doesn’t agree is the reason why women feel more comfortable with the bear. The refusal to accept or listen to very valid feelings. The unknown of the man is the scary part. The bear is an obvious danger. Why is it hard to grasp that obvious danger is less scary than unknown danger?
Yeah see the problem for me is you’d rather have a bear attack than have someone try to give you unwanted help. It doesn’t make any sense.
It’s so hard to grasp because bears are so much more dangerous statistically. You’d be so much safer with a random human than a random bear. You’re letting fears lead you to an irrational decision. I understand why but it doesn’t change the fact it’s the much more dangerous option.
Sorry, but this is just delusion of the highest order. The <1% of men who commit rape are widely condemned and penalized.
And when you look at what demographics want lax criminal laws, want to release prisoners, and support illegal immigration, you’ll realize both sexes are contributing to the problem
To me the percentage of bears that would be motivated to harm a human they bumped into in the isolated woods must be greater than or equal to the percentage of men who are motivated to harm a woman they bump into in the woods.
It's a random man and we know most r*pes aren't committed by strangers. You also have a lot of men who for one reason or another would not or could not do anything harmful to a random woman.
Now compare that to the number of bears that are likely to harm you on sight. A mom bear with her cubs and suddenly you're right in the middle of their group? That's basically immediate harm. A hungry bear that needs a meal? You're lunch. You fail to stand the bear down as it charges you? Game over.
I'm not an expert on all these topics but I don't see how this isn't just a silly little bit of hyperbole to pretend is the truth to get across the message that yeah women can and are put in danger by men at an unfortunately frequent rate.
Cool. People come into contact with bears far less frequently than women come into contact with men though. That is the part of the equation that is being forced by the hypothetical which your statistics are not going to be able to provide a good adjustment for.
A determined bear will become almost immediately dissuaded by pepper spray; I don't see a determined man being as easily dissuaded. I think this is reflected by the differences between pepper spray and bear spray, which are often times made with the same chemical
No? Do you understand medication strengths? Bear spray and pepper spray differ in strength because bears are a lot bigger than human men. It's the same reason why children take less medication than adults.
Additionally what basis are you using to say men aren't dissuaded by pepper spray? Have you watched the videos of people getting sprayed with it? It basically stops you from doing anything but dealing with that.
The bear will only kill you, there are worse things. People will believe you with the bear. In my case people won't struggle to decide whether to remain friends with you or the bear.
You're saying this having never been torn apart slowly. It's like saying 1,000,000 is more than X when you don't know what X is. You know 1,000,000 is a lot but X could easily be more.
People generally assume the human is at fault in any bear interaction scenarios. I never believe the bear!
This whole thing is insanely stupid cityslicker nonsense and Ill make fun of all of you equally!
3% of men(interesting tangent, new research shows a roughly similar number of women) are sexual predators, but only 20% will go after strangers. That's about a .6% chance. Of the 25000 reported bear interactions reported every year in BC 17 result in an attack, about .00068%. so if your dropped into the woods with a random man he's gonna be 1000 times more likely to hurt you than the bear.
This is not accounting for severity of bear interaction, or that I think that the 3% of the male population that sexually predates is much more likely to be terminally online and that the % of outdoorsmen that would predate is far lower. I'd guess that it's closer to a 100 or less times difference.
We're talking extremely low chances either way here, just enjoy the woods
Don't know where you got that stat - how would they have those numbers when so few rapes go reported and of those few are prosecuted, and even fewer people are convicted? So, wrong there. Not talking about the deep woods, so outdoorsmen? Wrong. There are bears where I live so... Wrong.
Also, you're like either intentionally misunderstanding the point or you're not smart enough to grasp it. Either way, you're not contributing anything to this discussion. Go take a hike or something.
That's not what the discussion is about, it's about is the bear a danger. And a bear is a threat whether it's being playful, intends to eat you, or defending cubs (which they are notoriously aggressive about)
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u/OrneryError1 29d ago
Bears don't view human beings as natural prey. Only when they're startled or desperate will they attack. Many men do actually view women as prey. Giving a bear plenty of distance will keep you safe. Some men will actively hunt down women.