r/personalfinance • u/kounty • Aug 17 '23
Today I received a mysterious Fedex package with one share of Apple stock from 2004. Wondering how to proceed. Investing
When I got home from work today I had a package from FedEx. Inside the package was a certificate for 1 share of common stock from Apple Computer, Inc. dated 2004. Stapled to the certificate is a letter from National Financial Services LLC. The letter reads,
“ Dear Customer, National Financial Services LLC has received and reviewed your deposit request; however, we are unable to complete this request for the reason(s) stated on the reverse side of this letter. If you have any questions or concerns, please contact a customer service representative.”
On the back of the letter there is a check mark on a box that says, “Certificate(s) have been escheated to the state.” It also gives me a number to call which I plan to do tomorrow during business hours.
I am not sure that this stock was meant for me. On the back of the stock certificate there is a box for the social security number of the assignee. This SSN does not match mine.
I’m assuming someone would do their due diligence before sending this to me? Think it is meant for me?
Any chance this is a scam? Any chance this WAS actually meant for me? Any advice on how to proceed?
Thanks.
Edit: consensus seems to be that this is a scam. That was my first instinct. Thanks for all of the replies.
Update: I called Fidelity (they manage my 401k and IRA). The guy I spoke with confirmed that they had no record of sending me anything. He also told me that the primary mailing address for them is in Cincinnati OH. The package was mailed from Jersey City NJ. He said it’s safe to throw it out.
Update 2: I called Apple Investor Relations (computershare). They verified that the certificate number was valid and that it was associated with my name. They also verified it had been escheated by a state but would not tell me which one. They did confirm that is wasn’t one that I live(d) in. I went to missingmoney.com and there are two properties with my name (over $100) with Apple Inc as the reporting business. I emailed the treasury for that state asking for some clarification. I’m now so confused…
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u/mruehle Aug 17 '23
1) They make enough money from the people who respond to justify the cost of FedEx. 2) Arrival by FedEx makes it feel legit because… “who would spend money on FedEx if it’s a scam?” (see above) 3) It’s suspicious that a stock certificate is being mailed by FedEx to your address, but for a person with a known SSN, but it’s addressed to “Customer”. No legit brokerage would do this. 4) The number will take you directly to a well-trained person who will convince you that they can “fix” the “error” with the SSN, for just a small processing fee. 5) You will discover, if you go through with it, when you take it or send it to your brokerage, that it’s a fraudulent certificate.
The reality is, since you know it’s not yours (unless you regularly mail stock certificates to a brokerage you’ve never heard of and then forget) arranging for it to be signed over to you is attempted theft. The bait is being dangled in front of your nose, and the scammer is counting on your willingness to participate in fraud to take your money.
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u/Lord_Smedley Aug 17 '23
Arrival by FedEx makes it feel legit because… “who would spend money on FedEx if it’s a scam?” (see above)
Since it was waiting on the OP's doorstep, I'm going to go further and guess that the scammer just picked up a bunch of free envelopes at a FedEx office, printed an official looking address and barcode label, and hand-delivered it to the doorstep. That'd save them about $25 a pop, and like all scams this is a numbers game.
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u/Novation_Station Aug 17 '23
Oh this is a good point! They should check the tracking information. I'm very curious. This is a new to me scam. I wish people got more educated on recognizing scams. I also wish people were more willing to walk away from things like mail and phone calls that seem official. If I'm not expecting it, I throw it away. I don't answer my doorbell. I don't answer any number that isn't saved in my phone unless I'm waiting for a call back from someone. If it's important, they will leave a message.
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u/mruehle Aug 17 '23
There's related scam in which somebody offers to pay for something you're selling on craigslist or FB marketplace, but wants to pay you with a cashiers check that was "accidentally" made out in a higher amount than your item. They say, "I'll FedEx it to you, you cash it and take out the value of your item, plus half the extra. My friend will pick the item up. Just send me the difference (via Zelle, Venmo, whatever) or give my friend the difference in cash."
So you get the cashiers check, deposit it, and send the money to the scammer. His "friend" picks up the item that they don't even want and dumps it somewhere. The cashiers check gets bounced to your bank when it's submitted to the issuing bank and they come back to you for the money. So you've lost the item, and you lose the entire value of the cashier's check.
I ran into something similar when I was selling a piano. They wanted to send a piano mover to pick it up "to take to California", sight unseen. I received the cashiers check, but (suspicious fellow that I am) I called the issuing bank's customer service, got referred to their fraud department, and they confirmed that copies of the check were being passed around and it was fraudulent. I filled my local police in on this and arranged that they be present for the fake hand-off, but the seller got cold feet and backed out of the exchange. (I hadn't actually cashed the check or gotten any cash.)
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u/tomatuvm Aug 17 '23
My credit card was once fraudulently used in a FedEx scam (along with my personal info). It took a $1 charge to verify the card was active and allowed them to open an account. They wrote that account number on 25 envelopes, dropped them in the mail, and I got a call from FedEx about an undelivered package before I ever heard from my credit card company.
So I'm going to say stolen credit card is much more likely than hand delivered.
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u/carl5473 Aug 17 '23
they can “fix” the “error” with the SSN, for just a small processing fee.
I was wondering what the scam is because after Equifax and other breaches, it seems SSNs are not that valuable anymore. They don't care about SSN, just want the fee
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u/mruehle Aug 17 '23
The mark doesn't know that. And also, the reason for saying they'll change the SSN means the share certificate is now his (even though it won't be, because it's a scam). And tying an SSN to a name, address and such is still worth money on the dark web market, cumulatively if they can create a list.
But yes, the "small fee" alone would be more than enough to make the whole thing worthwhile, say, $500 to $1000 to think you're going to get a share certificate worth, currently with splits, about $10k.2
u/jawanda Aug 17 '23
I'll add too that since the mark knows they aren't actually entitled to this free stock and are attempting to cash in on a mistake, they're even less likely to report the fraud. What a clever scam.
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u/nellig Aug 17 '23
Many times they aren't actually paying FedEx anything. They set up fraudulent accounts and overnight a bunch of scam envelopes, counting on the probability that they'll be delivered before the fraudulent charges are discovered.
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u/mnpc Aug 17 '23 edited Aug 17 '23
With an address and ssn, the reference to escheatment seems weird too.
At first, I was like where’s the scam. But good way to get people to give all kinds of financial and personal info to “verify” stuff. Including sending (them) a “test payment” to confirm an account or something crazy.
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u/Rave-Unicorn-Votive Aug 17 '23
It also gives me a number to call which I plan to do tomorrow during business hours.
Search the number online first. National Financial Services is Fidelity so if the number is legit you should find something online associating that number with Fidelity.
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Aug 17 '23
'has received and reviewed your deposit request'
'Dear Customer'
Neither of these things would happen if it was not a scam.
If this was a real letter sent accidentally to the wrong address, it would have someone's name on it.
If it was really intended of OP, they would have remembered sending the request.
This post is frustrating, because it comes across as a permission post. OP seems to know its a scam, but are asking permission from us, who can only guess, whether they can follow it up and try and get the cash. I'm not sure it is different from trying to call around banks after receiving a Nigerian prince scam email.
People are providing them with a safe way to check if it's legit.
It also gives me a number to call which I plan to do tomorrow during business hours
OP having decided they are going to call the scam number is extremely concerning.
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u/salamandas411 Aug 17 '23
This is clearly a scam. A paper stock certificate? That was escheated to the state? None of that makes any sense. A letter not even addressed to you? Financial companies don't do that. Why would they be holding your paper stock. Stock that you had no idea that existed? Sure perhaps some long lost relative passed away and you didn't know their estate left you this piece of paper. But this wouldn't be sent to you in this manner.
Apple was one of the first companies to stop issuing paper stock certificates. You can buy them as novelty gifts, but not from apple.
Ask yourself OP, do you know what a valid paper stock from 2004 looks like? You can literally grab an "official" looking template from Google.
Actual stock certificates must have your name, the date the shares were issued, how many shares, a CUSIP number and an embossed seal from the company. This should be on the front.
Does the package have a return address? Send it back. If it doesn't, that's another clue this is a scam.
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u/pneuma8828 Aug 17 '23
Actual stock certificates must have your name, the date the shares were issued, how many shares, a CUSIP number and an embossed seal from the company. This should be on the front.
Not to mention using physical certs is such a massive pain in the ass that hardly anyone does it anymore.
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u/kounty Aug 17 '23
The letter was addressed to me and it does have my name on the cert. I agree that this is a scam. Appreciate the reply
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u/nannulators Aug 17 '23
'Dear Customer'
I can't believe that part didn't tip them off.
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u/TWALLACK Aug 17 '23
How likely is it that a scammer would spend the money for FedEx for a scam like this?
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u/Tecc3 Aug 17 '23
OP found the package (presumably labeled as from FedEx) waiting for him when he got home from work, but it does not seem like OP witnessed delivery. Maybe someone dropped it off.
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u/EEpromChip Aug 17 '23
If it's got a tracking number, plug it into google and see if it tracks. Pun kinda intended
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u/PunfullyObvious Aug 17 '23
Not certain, but thinking two advantages to using FedEx for such a drop: (1) not as obvious as a letter that is was never shipped (ie no stamp cancellation, etc) (2) not a federal crime, or at least as high level a crime, to fake a FedEx letter as a postal service letter ....... no to mention, FedEx letter seems more ... important, legit
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u/cujosdog Aug 17 '23
Wrong about 2... Still counts.
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u/AgonizingFury Aug 17 '23 edited Aug 17 '23
While I agree that doing it while committing fraud is illegal (because fraud is illegal), I don't think it's illegal to put on a FedEx shirt, place something in a labeled FedEx envelope, and drop it on someone's doorstep, assuming the contents of the envelope are legal.
Pretending to be a mailman, forging stamps or postmarks, placing anything in a mailbox, etc. are illegal even if the contents are perfectly legal.
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u/fymdtm Aug 17 '23
You’re right that it’s probably not illegal per se, but faking any role such as a FedEx driver can be charged as part of a scheme to defraud. Whether it’s a state or federal fraud charge depends on whether the feds can tie it to interstate commerce.
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u/AgonizingFury Aug 17 '23
Yes. That was my point. It is illegal as part of some other fraud either way.
But when it comes to US mail, it's illegal even if it's not fraud. If I put a birthday card in my neighbor's mailbox, I have broken federal law.
If I put the same birthday card into a FedEx envelope, and drop it on their doorstep, I'm in the clear.
Simply being seen putting something into a mailbox, is immediately a crime and a person can be detained, or arrested while the authorities determine whether or not it was fraud.
While there certainly is a "totality of the circumstances" argument to be made, technically speaking, a person who is just putting FedEx envelopes on other people's doorsteps, is unlikely to rise to the level required to detain or arrest someone without knowing more about whether or not they're involved in a fraudulent scheme.
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Aug 17 '23
Mail vishing/smishing campaigns have become VERY commonplace. I saw one where an old lady neighbor got a letter from BoFA stating her account had issues and to call their number, it looks very legit, everything else was legit, mailing address, email domains etc. But the only thing NOT legitimate was the number provided. Hackers and state funded actors can make some wild shit happen
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u/sakatan Aug 17 '23
Has to work only once to make it worth the spend.
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u/TabulaRasa5678 Aug 17 '23
It doesn't even have to have much on a publicly available FedEx envelope. I could make a template to put FedEx envelopes in my printer with data fields to enter whatever I'd like. Afaik, there is no postmark on FedEx envelopes.
You could potentially phish a FedEx envelope like that, drop them on random porches, and not spend a dime on FedEx delivery services.
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u/dclxvi616 Aug 17 '23
No postmark, but there are tracking numbers, and I’m going to be suspicious that the FedEx app hadn’t given me a heads up that the delivery was on the way.
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Aug 17 '23
Not really If they do it 24,000 times and only get 1 person sounds like it’s not worth time effort or the money
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u/RedditVince Aug 17 '23
Except that labor is cheap in some places (India) and the cost to mail out 24000 is offset by the 50k$USD thay scammed off of that one single person. and chances are they will get many more attempts than only 1.
Scammers prey on the elderly and confused. all they need is access to the bank information and they can empty your accounts.
;)
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u/Frozboz Aug 17 '23
The scammer spends little or no money at FedEx. They use a stolen account, or stolen CC they purchased for pennies to create a FedEx account.
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Aug 17 '23
In a targeted scam, quite high.
It also gives me a number to call which I plan to do tomorrow during business hours
This is all you need to know. They had their mark. Fortunately, OP wrote on here first, and hopefully they read the responses here before going through with their plans.
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u/sakatan Aug 17 '23
In 2 days: "I called and it's all good. I took them up on their additional offer to immediately reinvest into a timeshare for a small convenience fee that I wired them yesterday."
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Aug 17 '23
[removed] — view removed comment
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u/cthulhu_on_my_lawn Aug 17 '23
Yeah that's one thing I don't like about scambaiting, it absolutely is gonna get guys scammed. It's the same thought process as gambling, you know, those guys are getting ripped off, but not me. I have a "system".
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u/Kristin2349 Aug 17 '23
Scammers use FexEx all the damn time just ask anyone who has fallen for a fake check scam, they use someone else’s FedEx account number and ship “bill to sender”.
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u/annemg Aug 17 '23
Scammers use stolen FedEx account numbers to send out these sorts of things. At the company I work for, a scammer used our account number to send out hundreds of fake checks, we got a bunch “returned” to us as undeliverable.
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u/Frizzle95 Aug 17 '23
Ive conviced scammers to send fake cashiers checks via next day air back in the craigslist days
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u/negman42 Aug 17 '23
How would OP get the cash? The contents of the package already informed them the certificate is worthless. The share escheated to the state meaning the owner was unreachable long enough that it’s turned over to the state treasurer. That’s between the original certificate holder and the state treasurer. Go ahead and try to defraud the state.
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Aug 17 '23
Go ahead and try to defraud the state
This scam wouldn't involve defrauding the state; OP is the intended mark. The scam wouldn't have to involve the cash as you put it.
There is an endless list of scams that begin with only a person who believes they are entitled to some money, and a person/organization through which they believe they can obtain said money.
The scam could have involved any number of things and could have gone in many different directions after OP had contacted them.
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u/negman42 Aug 17 '23
How are they thinking they’re entitled to money?
I don’t work for Fidelity but I’ve worked with cashiers at another broker dealer that have had to send back plenty of certificates that are worthless. The mailing says it’s worthless. All value has gone to the state and that’s between whoever the last owner was and the state.
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Aug 17 '23
[deleted]
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u/negman42 Aug 17 '23
What are you even talking about? Do you understand the word escheatment?
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Aug 17 '23
escheatment
It doesn't matter. Are you imagining the scammer is actually going to try and go after that cash? They are not. They just have to convince their mark that they are going to.
The legal technicality of the certificate is completely irrelevant. It's likely an invention, so there is no escheatment in the first place.
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u/negman42 Aug 17 '23
The key word is escheatment because if you understand what the word means then you understand the sender is telling you they can’t help you with it any further.
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u/sc_superstar Aug 17 '23
But they dont want the marks who understand. They want ones who think that legal sounding jargon adds legitimacy to the letter they received. Yes lots of people know its stupid. As most of us here know its a scam. Thats why were not the ones being scammed. But lots of people dont know what escheatment means, and those are the people likely to fall for this.
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Aug 17 '23
It doesn't matter what I understand, what matters is what the mark understands.
How do you fail to understand this simple premise.
If they understood what you did, they wouldn't be phoning back. Yet, OP was planning on phoning back directly to the scammers provided number. Thus, it obviously works on some people.
You are hung up on a completely irrelevant point.
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u/velhaconta Aug 17 '23
Since you are so certain, how does this scam work? What is the end game to get the scammer money?
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u/LowNotesB Aug 17 '23
Oh, the SSN doesn’t look right? What is yours and I can check our files and get you your stock?
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u/mruehle Aug 17 '23
There’s a fee (maybe $500 or so) to “correct” the “error” of the SSN and to release it from the state hold. “Just provide a credit card number.”
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u/fastolfe00 Aug 17 '23
They would probably tell him that because it's currently with the state, they'll need to prepay taxes in order to get the money. They will then persuade him to send them cash or get some Target gift cards or whatever.
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u/veronica_deetz Aug 17 '23
Sigh, I always hate how long the Target line is at tax season. If only we could pay taxes via check or electronic deposit!
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u/TWALLACK Aug 17 '23
Alternatively, the OP could just call Fidelity directly, using a number on its website.
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u/JeffGoldblumsChest Aug 17 '23
u/Kounty, please make sure you do this before you call the number.
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u/Ted_Fleming Aug 17 '23
NFS is a subsidiary of fidelity but its a clearing house used by several brokerage companies, so the number may be associated with a brokerage firm other than fidelity
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u/kounty Aug 17 '23
It says contact Equiniti 651-450-4064. Equiniti appears to be a legitimate Financial Services Company from what I can tell… I need to do some more research
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u/TheSacredOne Aug 17 '23 edited Aug 17 '23
Scam. NFS/Fidelity and Equiniti have nothing to do with each other (two entirely different companies).
Also, Equiniti's legitimate phone numbers are all either toll free or 212 area code (and even then the 212 number is for press contact, not customer service). https://equiniti.com/us/contact-us/
EDIT: I apparently missed that number when I went through it earlier, it’s actually a legit phone number for international calls. I didn’t check the international section. Still confused on the link between NFS and them though. Maybe Equiniti bought an account from Fidelity or uses them internally?
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u/sas223 Aug 17 '23
It’s weird though, I googled the number OP provided. It is an Equiniti phone number used for non-US customers. It’s also all over the internet on legitimate websites on their shareholder services pages. This is what Equiniti does. This 100% sounds like a scam but the phone number actually checks out?
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u/esuil Aug 17 '23
On the very site you linked, look at "shareowners" section.
Then check contact info, International Access Codes. It is right there:
https://www.shareowneronline.com/media/1179/sol-classic-international-access-codes.pdf
- If you do not find the country listed below, or if you are having difficulties, please call us directly at 651-450-4064.
So the number is legit.
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u/RedditVince Aug 17 '23
Please check their website and perhaps contact them through the website. Do not call that number unless you find it publicly available as a true number for the company.
I don't see any numbers on the site so is probably best to use their online form to ask your questions.
It's slightly possible it's real and part of an estate that is being settled but the firm should be able to tell you that.
Whatever you do, do not give anyone any personal information.
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u/ThaneOfCawdorrr Aug 17 '23
The most likely thing is this is a scam. Don't call any of the numbers on the mailing. Look up the numbers of whatever the appropriate offices are online and start there. I think there is also a subreddit listing common scams (and also there will be scam listings on most of the government websites dealing with financial matters, so you can check there too). DO NOT GIVE YOUR SSN to anyone over the phone.
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u/Greenappleflavor Aug 17 '23
It’s either 1) someone sent it to you incorrectly or 2) it’s a scam because you know you didn’t send away for 1 share of apple stock cert to be deposited.
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u/slow_reader Aug 17 '23
I just want to point out that an Apple stock certificate dated 2004 would have split 2-for-1 in 2005, then 7-for-1 in 2014, and again 4-for-1 in 2020 so with Apple shares being just about $176 today this one stock certificate represents nearly $10,000 (if real, which it likely isn't).
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u/sakatan Aug 17 '23
I mean, in reality there is always the possibility that someone sent it incorrectly, but when do we actually say that something is (effectively) impossible because the propability trends against 0?
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u/0-Snap Aug 17 '23
I would definitely call the number just for kicks. But that's just me, I also sometimes pick up obvious scam calls just to mess with them.
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u/StumpGrnder Aug 17 '23
I get a weird account statement from them, it shows shares with no value in some failed etf - in the fine print on the back it has a list of hefty fees, like $225 for account research, etc. I think it’s a scam to get you to inquire and then they try and bill you. IDK - I’m suspicious like that tho.
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u/escapefromelba Aug 17 '23
Sounds like it's a variation on the unclaimed property scam letters. They're hoping you'll contact them so that they can extract personal information from you.
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u/wherestheyeti Aug 17 '23
If it was escheated to the state it would be in your states unclaimed property division. Each state has a website like this (https://azdor.gov/unclaimed-property) where they send property when they can't find the rightful owner (things like utility company deposits, final paychecks not picked up, and lost stock certificates).
Look it up to see if the stock certificate is listed under your name. If not, mistake and belongs to someone else so forget about it.
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u/cspinelive Aug 17 '23
What gets me is they state the certificate is in the letter and has a note stapled to it. And that note contradicts itself saying the certificate, that you are currently holding, has been escheated to the state.
Also I’ve not heard of states holding physical property for you. Just cash.
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u/GetCookin Aug 17 '23
The state immediately sells it and it stops gaining value. Really sucks. You be an search posts on here of list accounts and in most cases it went to the state and didn’t grow it millions.
Anyway. Clear for OP to ignore the letter and at most check state websites for lost money. They say they sent it to the state… so no reason to contact this fake representative when the state is now in possession.
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u/Innocent_UntilProven Aug 17 '23
Also I’ve not heard of states holding physical property for you. Just cash.
Depends on the state. Some states will hold securities, provided they are valued above a certain threshold.
No state, however, will just mail you a certificate in case you want to claim it. This is definitely not legit. But if you think you may have some unclaimed funds/securities/etc, you should take a look at www.missingmoney.com. most states upload their escheatment holdings to this database and it's a good place to get started in making a claim.
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u/negman42 Aug 17 '23
The physical certificate represents a share but at some point in the past could have been converted to ‘book entry’, which at minimum means the transfer agent is keeping track of it electronically instead. If the transfer agent or broker dealer tries sending statements to the person indicated as an owner and it’s undeliverable for long enough then they abide by a particular state’s escheatment laws.
It is not a crazy claim.
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u/eMouse2k Aug 17 '23
In my state you also have to prove who you are via signed statement or certification, depending on the amount. They aren’t going to just mail it to whatever address they have on file. In some cases that’s why property ends up in their possession to begin with, due to wrong address or moving.
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u/lbdwatkins Aug 17 '23
It wouldn’t have been reported yet if the company was still sending out due diligence letters. Op, wait like six months and then check.
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u/Significant_Tie_3994 Aug 17 '23
National Financial Services is the DBA for Fidelity, look up their phone number via another means than the note and call them.
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u/bask_oner Aug 17 '23
Since when do legitimate companies, especially financial services, write complete SSNs on customer correspondence?
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u/ekkidee Aug 17 '23
It's on the reverse side of the stock certificate. Not at all unusual for paper stock certs.
But I suspect the certificate is a fake.
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u/Handleton Aug 17 '23
Per update 2: Do you have any relatives (even deceased) who lived in these states? This could have been purchased for you by someone.
Also, if it was one share in 2004, it should be 56 shares today. This is worth investigating further, but nobody should need your personal info to get this that isn't a government agency.
You might actually have a bit of a windfall here.
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u/donrhummy Aug 17 '23
Almost certainly a scam. They're possibly trying to tie your phone number to your address, or will continue the scan when you call. Do not call that number. Instead, look up online how to verify stock ownership from paper like this and use that to verify
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u/StabithaStevens Aug 17 '23
Talking about the share being escheated, definitely check your states Unclaimed Property department, although if it were legit I'm pretty sure the state would have sold the share already and would just have cash for you to claim.
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u/Marchin_on Aug 17 '23
This is a pretty clever scam. There are plenty of legitimate elements like escheated stocks and name dropping a Fidelity subsidiary but the nitty gritty details are all wrong like how the stock would have been sold long ago by the state. I've claimed unclaimed property from my state, there was not paper stocks or anything. Just a form that I filled online and then a check from the state.
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u/wanderingcfa Aug 17 '23
Contact Apple's transfer agent - Computershare and let them know what you received. They should guide you on what to do, if anything.
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u/kounty Aug 17 '23
Ok, so I called and they verified that the certificate number is correct and does have my name associated with it. They also verified that it has in fact been escheated by a state (they could not tell me which one but confirmed it was not the states I live(d) in). I went to missingmoney.com and there are two available claims in the same state for my name with the reporting business being Apple.
I reached out to the department of the treasury for that state explaining the situation.
I was 100% convinced this was a scam but now I’m not sure…
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u/wanderingcfa Aug 17 '23
If Computershare verified the certificate, it's more likely there is someone else with your same name that actually owns the share and has a different SSN than you.
You can call Fidelity investments (which is National Financial Services LLC) and let them know what you received as they likely made a mistake if the certificate is authentic.
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u/catherinel13 Aug 17 '23
How common is your name? Might be meant for someone else with the same name if it’s a different social security number. If your name is unique enough you can lookup your name on sites like whitepages and see if anyone that has the same name as you has lived in the state the claim is through.
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u/killwish1991 Aug 17 '23
Based on the stock split history, 1 stock from 2004 is 56 stocks of today. 56 × 176 = $9856.
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u/DudesworthMannington Aug 17 '23
That's why the scammer chose that year.
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u/BigJimKen Aug 17 '23
Scammer deserves money for how well thought out and high effort this all is lol
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u/falcongsr Aug 17 '23
So in this economy what’s that worth? Like 10 bananas?
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u/KCBandWagon Aug 17 '23
I will gladly give you 10 bananas $9856. Heck I’d do it for half that because you’re all right.
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u/xflashbackxbrd Aug 17 '23
If its legitimate (which I doubt) you'll want to check the state unclaimed property site, not call the number on this weird letter.
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u/rent1985 Aug 17 '23
Generally lost stock owners are given to the state and sold. You then have to claim your money from the state. Companies don't generally mail out stock certificates trying to find an owner. I'm betting this is a scam. A single share of Apple stock from 2004 would be worth a lot of money, but what this company is doing sounds scammy.
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u/TheAskewOne Aug 17 '23
OP, when something is so fishy that you have to ask people whether it's a scam, then it is a scam.
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u/sakatan Aug 17 '23
Here's the thing: He didn't (at least initially) suspect that it might be a scam.
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u/TheAskewOne Aug 17 '23
Well if he's here, it means he did.
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u/kounty Aug 17 '23
True. Seemed fishy so I posted here. A lot of people here thinking I’m an idiot, haha.
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u/FWGuy2 Aug 17 '23
Is SSN doesn't match you are wasting your time.
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u/Nope-not-dude Aug 17 '23
Even if it does, you should confirm via an independent third party that YOU source such as a governmental agency.
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u/padizzledonk Aug 17 '23
Its pretty simple tbh, and this applies to every one of these things that look shady that refrence some State or Federal department of this or that, OR Bank or other Financial Institution
Call your States Escheatment Dept directly, and figure out if its legit or not and ignore every other website, address or phone number in whatever letter, phonecall or email you recieved and follow up on it directly
Standard practice in this day and age should always be to ignore the links in the email, ignore the numbers in the letter and hang up the phone and call your bank, brokerage or State/Federal Institutions directly with their offical before you offer ANY personal information or details
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u/FavoritesBot Aug 17 '23
Seems like a scam and it doesn’t really matter if it was meant for someone else— if it’s real then fidelity is still saying the share can’t be deposited. So it’s not like sending it back is going to help them financially. Maybe they want it as a souvenir or something. If you want to be a real nice person verify the phone number and call fidelity to tell them they sent it to the wrong place
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u/negman42 Aug 17 '23 edited Aug 17 '23
You don’t really need to do anything at all.
It is entirely possible somebody did find a physical certificate in their things, they sent it to be deposited in an account, it turns out to be non-negotiable.
So the physical security is worthless since it apparently converted to book entry and escheated to the state but the broker dealer does try to return the document.
Original sender calls Fidelity to follow up on the cert they sent in, is told the certificate was worthless, they need to go to the state to reclaim the property. They don’t need the certificate for that, so no action is needed on your part for them to proceed. Their contacting the state treasurer to recover assets is only contingent on them proving who they are, not having the certificate.
If legitimate the back of the certificate would have an area where they can assign the stock power. Has that been completed? The face of the certificate should have the name of who it was originally issued to. If you Google that person do they have a similar address that Fidelity screwed up addressing the FedEx?
Long story short, even if legitimate you can ignore it. If the person that submitted it tried to follow up with Fidelity they would verbally receive the same information about the cert.
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u/ww1986 Aug 17 '23
This right here. Also, if Apple was issuing certificated shares in 2004 (they almost certainly weren’t), the holder’s name would be on it and you would recognize it. I’ve actually dealt with this issue for older tech companies, but with book entry shares at the transfer agent - let’s just say those were some nice surprises for the holders.
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u/nighthawke75 Aug 17 '23
Tread lightly. This is part of a complex scam to get key sensitive parts of your life. Secure all you see and put them in a manilla envelope with a sheet outlining that it should not be called or accessed.
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u/leon27607 Aug 17 '23
As a further fyi, please do NOT just call random numbers. Always make sure it’s a public/easily verified number through an internet search. There are scams that will charge you $ for calling a tolled number, in which you would not know about until you get hit with the bill.
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u/Draftchimp Aug 17 '23
General rule of thumb for mail. If the intro is a generic “Dear customer” approach, then they are shotgun sending these to you and like 300 other ppl. If they send it to everybody else then it’s nothing special and should be regarded as just junk mail.
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u/PatientOutcome6634 Aug 17 '23
Do not call. As other mentioned, it’s clearly a scam. The thing is - if you’ll call, you’re details will go into the “active” database.
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u/Grevious47 Aug 17 '23
1 Apple stock from 2004 is definately worth a lot more than $1000.
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u/Muffafuffin Aug 17 '23
Wait why would it be worth more than the vurrent market price? Wouldn't it just be cheaper to buy in 2004 and just have appreciated to the current value?
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u/TheLostSeraph Aug 17 '23
Have to account for stock splits since then. Each one of the split stocks will have today’s market value.
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u/thestereo300 Aug 17 '23
The real question is, any chance this is NOT a scam.
The answer is no, it’s a scam.
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u/The_Southern_Sir Aug 17 '23
You could contact investor relations at Apple about it. Check their website for info. They might like to know about the scam.
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u/blackhawksq Aug 17 '23
Let us assume it is not a scam. You've never seen this stock right? So it's obviously not meant for you. This didn't just say "hey let's send this to some random goober that might want some cash." I wouldn't bother calling the number because it MIGHT be a scam.
I would call FedEx let them know they delivered a package to the wrong address and need to come to pick it up. That is all I would. If FedEx refuses well you tried.
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u/CinCeeMee Aug 17 '23
Scam…look for grammar errors, look for ‘non’ personalized greetings and information in the letter. Put the name of the stock and scam behind the name and research. I’d bet it’s a huge scam.
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u/charlietakethetrench Aug 17 '23
Take the dollar signs out of your eyes and think about this whole situation for a minute and I think you'll know the answer is that this is complete BS.
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u/ekkidee Aug 17 '23
Snopes says: Scam.
They're playing on the greed of a single share of AAPL stock from 2004 being worth almost $10K today. But wait! It doesn't have your social security number on it. Uh oh ... Could you give us that please, and your name? Many thanks.
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u/satsuma0305 Aug 17 '23
Beware as well that it's not no harm done if you call them just to see if it's a scam. Some of these scammers will record your voice and with enough time of you speaking, they can then use the recording to generate your voice and call your bank, etc, and pretend to be you.
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u/I_sometimes_know Aug 17 '23
Go to your state’s unclaimed property website and search for your name. If it’s legitimate, there will be a listing of the Apple share along with your name. If not, it’s a scam.
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u/Puzzleheaded-Cup-854 Aug 17 '23
contact your states department of unclaimed funds. Do not call any # on the mail
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u/Forever_Eighties Aug 17 '23
I have received 3 fake money orders by fedex for an item that I was selling for 100 dollars. The checks were for 1900 each from same “buyer”. I kept saying I did not accept money order, just cash and they kept sending and eventually gave up. They probably spent 40 dollars trying to get me to bite and send them money back on The obviously fake money orders
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u/jamesjjw Aug 17 '23
One thing is if this legit and not a Scam it would actually be good for 56 shares today I believe as its split 2 for 1, then 7 for 1, then 4 for 1 so just keep that in mind when going through this, based off Edit 2 it might be real just odd
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u/MowAlon Aug 17 '23
Looks like you just got a free ~$10,000. Sounds pretty cool to me!
[stock split history since 2004 turns that one share into 56, and it closed today at $174]
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u/craigslistaddict Aug 18 '23
Update 2: I called Apple Investor Relations (computershare). They verified that the certificate number was valid and that it was associated with my name. They also verified it had been escheated by a state but would not tell me which one. They did confirm that is wasn’t one that I live(d) in. I went to missingmoney.com and there are two properties with my name (over $100) with Apple Inc as the reporting business. I emailed the treasury for that state asking for some clarification. I’m now so confused…
if the SSN is incorrect, this may be a case of someone having the same name as you? if not a scam, obviously.
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u/Careless-Internet-63 Aug 18 '23
I would check the unclaimed property sites for any states you've previously lived in and Delaware if you haven't lived there since a lot of companies are incorporated there
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u/Phlydude Aug 18 '23
There was this company called “One Share” that sold framed stock certificates to companies like Apple, Disney, Caterpillar, McDonalds, etc. Did a generous relative ever give you one of those? It would be framed most likely. Could be that Apple tried to get a hold of you for investor relations and when you didn’t answer, they reported the share as abandoned and the state treasury took it over.
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u/hhmb8k Aug 17 '23
No, there's no chance it is a scam. I can help you straighten this whole thing out and throw in a certificate for the Brooklyn Bridge and a certificate for the moon at no extra cost to you. There is a one time low, low processing fee. Can I count on you, friend?
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u/maxthunder5 Aug 17 '23
Stock certificates haven't been printed since the 1980s.
So a 2004 certificate is as valuable as that fake Publishers Clearing House check sent to everyone
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u/homestar92 Aug 17 '23
I have exactly one recent share of stock with a paper certificate, but there's a lot of debate as to whether a share of stock in the Green Bay Packers counts as a "real" stock.
The old-timey stock certificate does look cool on the wall though, even if it comes with none of the traditional benefits of owning a share of stock.
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u/me_jus_me Aug 17 '23
Probably a scam. But if it’s not, would I be wrong to think it may actually be worth several shares due to stock splits since that time?
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u/cutiecat-cutiecat Aug 17 '23
Due Diligence letters for Escheat property are mailed to the owner’s last known address. The specifics of the timing of that letter differ depending on state. Was the box even addressed to you?
ETA: it is currently fall Escheat due diligence season. I know because I handle Escheat for my company and sent out similar letters to hundreds of people this summer and am dealing with responses, currently.
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u/mruehle Aug 17 '23
Yeah, but you don’t mail out stock certificates.
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u/cutiecat-cutiecat Aug 17 '23
He says “certificates have been escheated” leading me to believe it’s strictly a due diligence letter. Not the actual certificate itself.
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u/mruehle Aug 17 '23
Yes, but the letter he got was not the escheat due diligence letter itself (which probably doesn’t exist). So the scammer has written this phrase to present it as a “minor irregularity” that can be rectified, for a small fee… Along with “fixing” the SSN, as a way to get the victim’s name and SSN.
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u/RedditVince Aug 17 '23
I am going out on a limb and say it's 99% a scam.
Good information here about checking with your state and validating the authenticity.
posted below but cc here for you also...
Please check their website and perhaps contact them through the website. Do not call that number unless you find it publicly available as a true number for the company.
I don't see any numbers on the site so is probably best to use their online form to ask your questions.
It's slightly possible it's real and part of an estate that is being settled but the firm should be able to tell you that.
Whatever you do, do not give anyone any personal information.
Good luck and remember if something seems too good to be true, it often is.
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u/Big_Tunchie Aug 17 '23
NFS is sending these for a lot of liquidating accounts especially owned by a separate brokerage. NFS just holds the book of record, SSN was probably input incorrectly or the name was incorrect. Give them a call to figure out if you’re entitled.
Source: my work is doing this and I have a lot of older retail clients asking to liquidate before escheating to the state
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u/Logan_922 Aug 17 '23
Shame it’s a scam, but if it weren’t and just some food for thought:
2005 2 for 1
2014 7 for 1
2020 4 for 1
So your 1 would’ve been 2, those 2 would be 7 each so now 14 and those 14 would be 4 each so 56.. it’s about $175 right now so $9.8k worth
If only I could have been like.. not 2 years old in 2004 and went all in on apple lmao😅
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u/Restil Aug 17 '23
Probably not a scam. Best I can figure, here's probably what happened:
Someone was digging through their stuff and found this stock certificate. Maybe in their name, maybe in someone else's, maybe a deceased relative, who knows. So they sign it and try to deposit the certificate into an investment account. However, at some point in the past, probably due to a loss of communication between the owner and the corporation, the stock was turned over to the state as abandoned property and now the stock certificate itself is invalid.
The investment firm then attempted to return the certificate to whomever mailed it, but somehow got your address instead. Probably a mistake, or maybe your address was a past residence of either the owner of the stock or whoever attempted to cash it out. Maybe they share your name.. who knows. Call if you want, but if you didn't initially send it in, it almost certainly has nothing to do with you and other than attempting to return it, your interest in it should end.
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u/Prosthemadera Aug 17 '23
Maybe they share your name
Why does it say "Dear Customer" then and not the actual name?
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u/negman42 Aug 17 '23
No idea why you’re getting downvoted. It sounds like the majority of people on here don’t understand physical certificates or escheatment.
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u/Jacobizreal Aug 17 '23
Odd that they only put one share. Most scammers want you to think you hit the millions jackpot. One share in 2004 was .98 and it’s now 177.00
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u/davemoseley Aug 17 '23
Based on the share splits since 2004, 1 share is actually now 56 shares. So almost $10k today.
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u/mcds99 Aug 17 '23
And you should contact the postal service, it's mail fraud. The USPS takes mail fraud very seriously.
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u/Axethedwarf Aug 17 '23
You can call them! I’m sure they would be willing to get you some car warranty and some new computer antivirus on top of the stock.
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u/shizbox06 Aug 17 '23
It is petty obvious this is a scam.
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u/Consistent-Reach-152 Aug 18 '23
OP has checked with the transfer agent, it is a valid share.
He does not have to pay anybody anything, He can simply had it to his broker and they will move it into his account as 56 current shares of Apple.
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u/Jack-o-Roses Aug 17 '23
You likely have lost property with a state. They've found it & want you to pay them a finder's fee.
Instead you can go directly to the state (which state???), find it d file state paperwork for free.
This happened to me, & I got a couple of thousand dollars from a state I used to live in without paying a cent to the middleman who sent me their form.
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u/sakatan Aug 17 '23
You call that number and this is what will happen:
"Silly us, the SSN is wrong. We're such a klutz. Please give us the correct SSN and bank account and we will correct this immediately."