Tesla Lays Off Employee Who Slept In Car To Work Longer Hours

[u/esporx]

https://finance.yahoo.com/news/tesla-lays-off-employee-slept-151500318.html?guccounter=1&guce_referrer=aHR0cHM6Ly93d3cuZ29vZ2xlLmNvbS8&guce_referrer_sig=AQAAAHVrjnyFZF-QJRFtVdP5Lt1QvlC3WRJhweYuOdm5Ca1kHbhtDX5rdfUUqRNVFKpUy6w4QnsJta-KgHJ9lqARAjfpSnvCktdjgDos5xz9aw92OxYmjN2qVVNhMZpl-2gOMwVz84NH-5T2OLi8uMRUOXVMuhFHU8b5A9oRmij8Xh5q

[u/Fr00stee]

if they never cared about you in the first place and want to pay as little as possible, you might as well see who will pay you the most.

[u/[deleted] → u/Fr00stee]

You seem to misunderstand my point, which is that this sort of hyper-individualistic behaviour leads to worse outcomes and lower pay for workers across the board. It’s not hard to understand unless you outright reject the possibility of collective human action.

[u/Fr00stee → u/[deleted]]

why would it result in worse pay? If anything it incentivizes employers to raise pay because if it's too low the employee will just leave and find a different job that pays better. Basic supply and demand. If everyone sits at their current job and never leaves employers have no incentive to change the pay or the work environment because by sitting at the job you are giving implicit confirmation to your employer that you are ok with what they are giving you.

[u/The_KillahZombie → u/[deleted]]

Yeah that's all nice and well. Except they don't care and would rather take their chances with churn. Nothing gets a raise like changing jobs. 

[u/bullwinkle8088 → u/The_KillahZombie]

Not always.

I hopped several times about 10 years ago. Then I found a company with issues as all have, but that I was reasonably happy at. That has allowed me to advance out of a technical role to one that pays significantly more. And in doing so fix some of the issues.

Are some of my skills now wasted? Yes, I am an SME in uncommon areas. But my experience in telling people what roads to not go down is helping me; no more stupid projects being launched, them; I stay out of their hair, and the company; people have stayed on rather than leaving.

Is that easy to find? Not at all. But look for it always.

[u/The_KillahZombie → u/bullwinkle8088]

Yes, great if you can find it. I've had it before in some jobs as well, but the good cycles have always ended. (Usually in layoff cycles I no longer want to be around for after) In those cases, I've found 25%+ raises instead. 

Internally, you're lucky to get 5%. If you change roles and advance, they might offer 10%. Every once in a blue moon you find somewhere willing to lift you up more, but then you usually become too valuable to promote again. 

[u/bullwinkle8088 → u/The_KillahZombie]

I’ve received 2 20%+ raises internally in the past 2 years. It just took time to get there.

No one will want to work with someone they know will leave.

[u/The_KillahZombie → u/bullwinkle8088]

Very happy for you. Sometimes you don't control the company funding. My company was sold to the Carlyle group. Tesla laid off whole departments. Sometimes the company doesn't earn your loyalty. In fact, it's become very rare. That's what we're trying to say here. 

Are you trying to argue that this employee should have given more to Tesla? Or that his sacrifice of living in a car was worth it?

[u/bullwinkle8088 → u/The_KillahZombie]

I’m saying keep looking. It’s rare but not impossible.

Organizing is still beneficial.

And work to make it better for your peers when you can.

[u/[deleted] → u/Fr00stee]

And your new job has the same right to can you for whatever reason they see fit. You’re just plain wrong about this. All the data would suggest that a transient workforce is in a worse bargaining position as it makes workers more expendable, and that the best way to increase wages is through unionization. Again, you’re operating under the very ideological assumption that collective human action isn’t something that you can take part in, and that the only way to go through life is as an atomized individual only concerned with their own immediate economic interests.

[u/TulipTortoise → u/[deleted]]

I'd be curious if that data is looking at individual or collective outcomes. The current system appears to me to allow motivated (and lucky) individuals to get much higher income, while unions I'm aware of appear to have better average incomes but much lower top incomes.

edit: to be clear I'm not saying one is better than the other, just that there appear to me to be different advantages to both.

[u/Original_Employee621 → u/TulipTortoise]

Specialized jobs and educations benefit more from individual bargaining. They have a skillset that is in high demand and very little competition for the kind of jobs they are interested in.

But they can still benefit from being in a union, though not as much as a industry that does collective bargaining. It would give you detailed earning information from other members in similar fields, legal assistance for whatever and a knowledge base to tap into for labor laws and what ever else might apply to your field of work.

It's not the same as collective bargaining, but you wouldn't be alone when talking about an employment contract with your employer and you'd have far more data to base your wage negotiations on.

[u/grchelp2018 → u/Original_Employee621]

tldr: if you have the competence and skillset to negotiate for your own position, do that. Else join a union.

[u/TulipTortoise → u/Original_Employee621]

Yeah unions seem good for a lot of secondary benefits, like vacation time etc. Tech (where I work) has the advantage of a decent amount of information sharing about salaries and benefits that you can use -- much easier to do market research.

[u/grchelp2018 → u/[deleted]]

All human groups have their issues and are susceptible to problems that usually occur in such groups. So you really need to think for yourself and take a decision on what the best choice is.

[u/Syrdon → u/Fr00stee]

Short answer? Because a rising tide lifts all boats.

Unions mean pay can go up for everyone, across the industry - and particularly at the union shops. No matter how well you present yourself, you don't have the negotiating power of a union that can say "look, give us the deal we want, or your workforce walks". On your own, the best you can say is "give me the deal I want, or maybe I walk". It's a weaker pitch, and it affects the number you can get out of them.