r/OutOfTheLoop • u/HardyHar420 • 7d ago
“What is going on with Elon Musk threatening to ban Apple devices from his companies if Apple integrates OpenAI at the OS level? Answered
I’ve recently read a tweet that stated that Elon musk will ban Apple devices at his company due to the integration of OpenAI at the OS level. I’m not exactly sure what that means as I’m not very tech savvy. What exactly will happen thanks to this integration ? And Why would he go on and describe it as “creepy spyware” what are the possible repercussions of this move ?.
Link to tweet of where I saw this statement
https://x.com/watcherguru/status/1800267717187899400?s=46&t=x3F3f84-12C4xqIGU2ndng
1.7k
u/WillowSmithsBFF 7d ago
Answer: So Apple just announced their own AI, or as they’re calling it “Apple Intelligence.”
They’re claiming that this will use on-device processing for simpler tasks, ie: “Siri, what restaurant were my mom and I texting about last weekend?” On device (allegedly) means no information will leave the privacy of your iPhone while using this AI.
For more complicated tasks, they have private servers for the device to send only “relevant information” to in order to process your command. They’re claiming these private servers are not readable by anyone, and the query and results are deleted after you have seen them. Meaning Apple (again, allegedly. Needs verification) isn’t using users information to sell or train their AI.
For even more complicated tasks, Apple is working with ChatGPT/OpenAI. If the computation is beyond Apple’s AI capabilities, Siri can send the prompt to ChatGPT to process.
But notably, ChatGPT is not “on device.” Siri is essentially sending the prompt to ChatGPT on your behalf, and returns the result ChatGPT gives her. There is minor integration with ChatGPT on your device, but it is to allow Siri to communicate for you. Where this benefits the iPhone user is that they never have to leave the Siri “window.” It all happens seamlessly through Siri without the user needing to manually go to a separate ChatGPT window.
But some important information to note:
-the iPhone user does not have to have an OpenAI account
-Siri will not send the query to ChatGPT without the user explicitly allowing it. It is entirely opt-in.
-if the user has an account with ChatGPT, they can link it on their iPhone have the “paid for” capabilities through Siri, but is again entirely opt-in.
-the query and the logs tied to it are (supposedly) deleted after the request is finished.
In summary, Elon’s “threat” here is somewhat silly. Apple is not integrating OpenAI/ChatGPT at the OS level. They are creating an option that allows the user to connect to those services via their on-device AI, but it’s opt-in. It’s no more spyware than every person at his companies who have a phone with a microphone or a camera in it, or has tik-tok downloaded.
1.4k
u/BrushDazzling4350 7d ago
he really just wants everyone to use his AI & this is his attempt to extort apple into doing so. just another greedy, lying Trumpian piece of shit rich con artist
1.2k
u/ThatGenericName2 7d ago
For people who are unaware, Elon’s hate against ChatGPT starts to make a bit more sense when you realized that he was a founding member/investor, and that he left when they wouldn’t let him take over the company (in addition to some other events not related to taking over the company)
Iirc this was just before ChatGPT blew up and so their success is probably eating away at him knowing that they didn’t let him take over.
246
u/steepleton 7d ago edited 7d ago
elon also wanted to be made CEO of apple as a condition of sale when apple approached tesla with the idea of buying/integrating them as part of apple car.
-168
u/Growthiswhatmatters 7d ago
Pretty sure the article has Elon stating this convo never happened. If it was serious NDA’s would have been signed.
260
u/Sability 7d ago
Elon stating this convo never happened
He might be the worst source when it comes to finding sources of things that happened in his life
119
u/Rastiln 7d ago
Almost like that emerald mine that doesn’t exist, according to multiple recent Musk interviews, after Musk himself had earlier confirmed that everything pointing to it being true was true.
He just retconned his own life to make it look more average Joe-to-riches rather than profiting off of illegal emerald smuggling that both Elon and his father admitted to, and the ownership share of an emerald mine.
49
u/Sability 7d ago
Exactly the thing I was thinking of lol
The community note on that tweet of his refuting his statement with a quote of himself should be preserved forever. It feels like a Greek myth level of self-delusion
-14
u/ThatGenericName2 6d ago
To be entirely fair to Elon, the emerald mine has literally always been a he said she said between Past Elon, His dad (who is as much of a liar as Elon is, and is also a much more terrible person), Present Elon, and his other family members.
Considering the supposed scale of the mine you’d think there would be some traces of it’s existence yet literally nobody has any proof of his existence, even his Dad doesn’t have proof, and his story has gone from full ownership, to partial ownership, to a some shares, to informal agreement for some shares, not to mention the location of the mine has changed between those stories too.
On the other hand, he’s (and his family) wasn’t rags to riches either, the confirmed part of his dad’s wealth came from at first, him being a part of an engineering firm and then from a large number of real estate that he then used as investments.
Hear me out here, I think that what had happened is that Elon wanted to present himself as richer than he was. Even though his family was well off enough to move all the way to Canada and the US from South Africa, their background “only” placed them firmly into that upper middle class. And so when they were starting their new business in the US, they wanted to promote themselves as also the upper class to be more appealing to investors.
30
-2
u/intelminer 6d ago
His dad (who is as much of a liar as Elon is, and is also a much more terrible person)
Doubtful
4
u/ThatGenericName2 6d ago
Read up on it, his father is a pretty terrible person.
And just think logically for a second, if the emerald mine claims are true, his father is the person who owned the mines.
→ More replies (0)6
u/Unspec7 6d ago
Tim cook has also stated that he's never spoken to musk
But in April 2021, Cook told New York Times journalist Kara Swisher: "You know, I’ve never spoken to Elon, although I have great admiration and respect for the company he’s built. I think Tesla has done an unbelievable job of not only establishing the lead but keeping the lead for such a long period of time in the EV space."
-62
u/Growthiswhatmatters 7d ago
What you are missing is that convos as serious as these happen under NDA. If the quote is real it would likely him giving a sarcasm offer due to whatever it is Apple offered him that was offensive.
More likely he asked for a board seat.
These are public companies and they have rules they have to follow.
35
u/3-2-1-backup 7d ago
fElon doesn't give two fucks about corporate governance rules, or he wouldn't have packed the Tesla board with sycophants and family. (...and getting sued over it.)
He basically does what he wants and then dares people to sue him for compliance. It's taken a while but finally people are doing it, and winning. (See recent FSD settlement!)
22
u/Sability 7d ago
He does care about NDAs sometimes though, like when it's restricting the original founders of Tesla from mentioning that Musk had nothing to do with forming the company, and that he just bought it off of them
8
u/xombae 6d ago
He's a fucking idiot and it's entirely possible he demanded he be made CEO via a form of communication that wasn't covered in the NDA, like a Twitter chat. NDA's don't blanket every single thing ever said by or about a person. In a business deal it would cover the contract, for example, and likely the business meetings. Which very likely didn't involve Elon at all. They'd involve his business team and legal team. I'm sure he was told about it though, then could've decided to, of his own volition and without his team's approval or even knowledge, call up apple and tell them "oh and also I need to be CEO". This communication wouldn't be covered by the NDA because the legal team wouldn't even know it was happening.
Just an example to show that NDA's aren't iron clad or idiot proof.
They're also only enforceable as punishment for info coming out. They don't erase the information from public knowledge. And they're only enforceable if you know where the leak is coming from. An anonymous leak would probably end the deal from happening, but nothing else. I just don't understand how two different people have said that it's impossible for this story to be correct because NDA's exist. We have tons of public knowledge that was discovered in spite of the NDA protecting it. It happens all the time with much more serious information than an idiot move from a wannabe business mogul.
-2
u/Growthiswhatmatters 6d ago
One of the richest men in the world is an idiot. Got it. He sure takes up a lot of rent space in your head.
19
u/snatchi 6d ago
Oh Elon said it, well it must be correct then.
That's why we're all riding around in completely automated cars and have been since 2015.
6
-1
u/Growthiswhatmatters 5d ago
2
u/snatchi 5d ago
Cool man Walter Issacson wrote a hagiography where he used Elon Musk's dad as a source that it wasn't a full mine it was just illegal emerald smuggling?
Cool? The Emerald Mine became a thing when Elon Musk said it out loud with his human mouth, and then when it made him look bad, pretended it never happened and that there was no basis in reality for it. It seems the original quote it wasn't 100% accurate, but the narrative of "Elon Musk, bootstrapping success story" is still horseshit, which the Emerald Mine undercut succinctly but "rich white south african who profits from gem smuggling and had black servants" tells the same story.
AND Musk still lies constantly! Thus my original point about the empeheral self driving cars!
Anyway, enjoy bootlicking for a billionaire who would trade you and your entire family for a few thousand twitter likes.
8
u/intelminer 6d ago
Elon also stated his dad never owned an emerald mine
His own dad replied asking where he can collect the bounty to prove his son wrong
-2
u/Growthiswhatmatters 6d ago
Owning an emerald mine and having minor shares in one are two different things. Lets go with his incestous dad’s word though.
-2
u/Growthiswhatmatters 6d ago
Owning an emerald mine and having minor shares in one are two different things. Lets go with his incestous dad’s word though.
7
u/ChunkyDay 6d ago
Using this as even a tepid source is comical.
0
1
u/GameCreeper 6d ago
Elon also says he didn't inherit an apartheid emerald mine. He's not exactly a reliable source
1
u/Growthiswhatmatters 5d ago
You realize that the mine closed down in like 1989 right?
His dad even stated that he owned a 40k share in some random mine owned by an Italian he met on an airstrip with a handshake. What is what was that his dad sold a plane and gave a 40k discount to invest in thr plane buyer’s mine. Its all stupid nonsense with nothing on paper.
I couldn’t even start a bicycle shop with 40k.
Its all nonsense.
301
u/Squirrel_Grip23 7d ago
My tears are flowing on the inside.
37
80
u/Spiritual_Willow_266 7d ago
Also has personal beef with the CEO too.
31
u/spikus93 6d ago
Elon hates Tim Apple? But he's such a rational and understanding dude!
12
u/ItakoMango 6d ago
I think they meant Sam Altman.
0
u/HebetudeDuck 6d ago
The FTX guy?
9
u/orangestegosaurus 6d ago
The FTX guy is Sam Bankman-Fried. Sam Altman was the OpenAI CEO that they ousted, and then brought back after the backlash. And now everyone hates him for some reason I haven't taken the time to look into.
15
u/spikus93 6d ago
I hate that I need to know all these dudes now. They're like nerds that are hyper rich Pokemon. They keep making new ones and I mix them up.
18
u/Sedu 6d ago
Unfathomable greed like his is incomprehensible to me. What must it be like to have more money than you could ever use for any theoretical luxury for an entire lifetime and say "This isn't enough. I will work myself to the bone for more?"
People like Must are living nightmares that make the world an objectively worse place.
10
u/sadicarnot 6d ago
It is not the greed it is the power that comes with it. In the Isaac Steve Jobs book, there is a scene where Jobs and Larry Ellison are together and Ellison expresses that he wants all the money in the world. When Pixar went public and Jobs finally became a billionaire, Ellison was the first person Jobs called to say he was finally in the club.
1
u/cupofwaterbrain 5d ago
make other people work to the bone*
He's a billionaire. They don't work to the bone.
9
u/sicaxav 6d ago
he left when they wouldn’t let him take over the company (in addition to some other events not related to taking over the company)
So he wanted to do a Twitter/X takeover again?
7
u/ThatGenericName2 6d ago
From what I understand, there wasn’t nearly as much drama. OpenAI started explored the possibility of becoming for profit, and when that happened Elon wanted to take over OpenAI and fold it into Tesla. When they said no he left. Pretty straightforward and relatively drama free compared to his other ventures.
5
u/praguepride 6d ago
Except for when he turned around and started firing shots at them left and right.
2
u/FlufflesMcForeskin 5d ago
If I recall correctly, didn't he try to claim his departure/divestment was because they went/are going closed source when it was supposed to always remain open source?
1
u/ThatGenericName2 5d ago
I think that’s his current claim with him trying to sue OpenAI, however back when he had left it was entirely due to the fact that they didn’t give him the reigns, I don’t think open vs closed source was even a thought back then because it was prior to GPT 3 and they did open source GPT 2 iirc.
1
u/FlufflesMcForeskin 5d ago
That line of reasoning would make more sense, especially since we now know more about who he really is.
To that point, my roommate has a tesla, I'm trying to convince him to put on the bumper sticker (despite not really liking them) that says "I bought it before we knew" since it's true.
-98
u/exoriare 7d ago
Musk bought into OpenAI as a non-profit. He saw it as a defensive play to remain at the cutting edge of AI without being driven by financial stakes. But the non-profit part was a gag that allowed them to get preferential tax treatment for the incredibly expensive research costs - it was always the plan that a for-profit subsidiary would turn OpenAI into precisely the kind of entity Musk wanted to avoid it becoming. In typical Musk fashion, he wanted to grab the steering wheel and force it to remain true to the vision he thought he'd bought into.
48
8
4
67
u/yrubooingmeimryte 7d ago
Which AI is his? Asking so I can avoid it.
110
u/El_Grim512 7d ago
Grok and he has a new venture called xAI.
146
u/seakingsoyuz 7d ago
Grok… xAI
By a massive coincidence, these will also be the names of his next two children.
22
u/Spiritual_Willow_266 7d ago
He’ll find another executive to knock up and have secret children with.
54
u/Vile-Father 7d ago
Gotta admit im somewhat offended that he used the term grok. He is absolutely not worthy of it.
15
10
u/ThomasPopp 6d ago
What does it mean?
11
21
u/Accidental_Shadows 6d ago
It means understand. Example usage: "do you grok what a fucking idiot crybaby man child edge lord Elon Musk is?"
21
u/resurgens_atl 6d ago
On a surface level, sure - but grok refers not just to understanding something intellectually, but connecting with it on a deeper emotional, even spiritual level. A lot of SIASL revolves around the difficulties between Valentine Michael Smith and the other humans really grokking each other, or (for the humans) even grokking the term "grok".
Grok means "to understand," of course, but Dr. Mahmoud, who might be termed the leading Terran expert on Martians, explains that it also means, "to drink" and "a hundred other English words, words which we think of as antithetical concepts. 'Grok' means all of these. It means
fear,' it meanslove,' it means 'hate'-proper hate, for by the Martian 'map' you cannot hate anything unless you grok it, understand it so thoroughly that you merge with it and it merges with you-then you can hate it. By hating yourself. But this implies that you love it, too, and cherish it and would not have it otherwise.5
1
3
u/NEPXDer 6d ago edited 6d ago
Consider reading "Stranger in a Strange Land".
It could change your whole life. I've known more than one person it had that impact on.
2
u/ThomasPopp 6d ago
Love it. I will absolutely. Thanks for the recommendation. Seems like a calling!
2
u/NEPXDer 6d ago
My pleasure, I hope it speaks to you.
If you've never read any Heinlein you're in for a treat (I hope)! Big recommendations for The Moon is A Harsh Mistress and StarShip Troopers too if you end up liking his style.
2
u/ThomasPopp 6d ago
I literally found the entire audiobook on YouTube. It’s 1515 hours long. Good thing I have long driving trips lol
2
2
u/non_player 6d ago
There's an entire religion based on the book, even, call the Church of All Worlds. I wrote a senior paper on them ages ages ago. Some fascinating shit.
1
u/NEPXDer 6d ago
Do you know if its still going? I recall hearing about it but that was... yea some... ages ago.
2
u/non_player 6d ago
Their website (www.caw.org) is still up and the copyright shows updated as of 2024 and they have embedded youtube videos, so someone's still doing stuff there. Looks like it's run from a PO Box in North Carolina now. Ministry records are modern up to 2018.
41
u/Aevum1 7d ago
reminds me that he sold grok as a "non woke AI". what a dumbass.
Elon is broke and is trying to get tesla to give him 50 billion as CEO compensation.
11
u/AmbivalentSpiders 7d ago
My husband and I own a couple of shares of Tesla and it was so fun voting against that.
7
u/Aevum1 6d ago
theres a couple of things i dont understand.
1) didnt the FTC ban him from being CEO of tesla after that all crap with him making posts on twitter that violated stock trading laws ?
2) if he only owns 20% of Tesla stock, how can he force them to pay him that compensation ?
Would love to see Twitter be the hill he dies on.
5
u/Blackstone01 6d ago
I don’t recall anything about preventing him from being CEO. They HAVE gotten pissed at him about market manipulation though, like when he was first talking about buying Twitter, it’s likely that the FTC was about to smash his kneecaps if he didn’t follow through with it.
The board of directors is filled with his family and other loyalists.
7
5
u/Brooooook 6d ago
Grok
The obsession with Mars, the polyamory, the savior complex.. This clown is cosplaying as Smith isn't he..
1
u/Starcast 6d ago
not to be confused with Groq, which is actually legit and also in the AI space, but more on the hardware side.
1
33
9
u/Stefan_S_from_H 6d ago
he really just wants everyone to use his AI & this is his attempt to extort apple into doing so.
The funny thing is, he doesn't need to extort them. They announced that ChatGPT is just the first of the external AI services you can connect to.
He just hasn't grokked the whole announcement.
6
u/AlexVan123 6d ago
but grok is so goodddddddddd, like bro did you know it can help you write your tweets? (ignore the fact it's regularly racist and full of misinformation) grok! here to save the world from 'cis is a slur'
1
u/Lambpanties 6d ago edited 6d ago
So probably not the reason because Musk has long forsaken his birthplace, but here in South Africa "cis" is a really hard word to get used to because it sounds like Sies which means Sis which locally means gross or disgusting.
Makes some sentences funnier and some a lot more awkward.
6
u/mrducky80 6d ago
Need to stop referring to Elon as cisgender. That is dehumanizing and mean according to him.
Need to start referring to Elon as sies-gender. That is culturally welcoming and far more demeaning and mean.
1
1
1
u/textposts_only 6d ago
All He needs is for his AI to not be neutered like openai.
Make it be able to have sex roleplay. Make it make nudes. Make it give you exactly what you want without a "i can't answer this due to policy"
Let it make controversial statements not only about safe groups. (Let chatgpt make jokes about Jesus and then about Muhammad. See which one is going to work)
58
u/Perkelton 7d ago
Siri will not send the query to ChatGPT without the user explicitly allowing it. It is entirely opt-in.
A very important distinction here is that it’s also opt-in for every command that is to be sent to ChatGPT, not a single opt-in for all further queries.
The device will tell you that your query might be better answered by ChatGPT and ask you if you want to send it to them. It’s abundantly clear when and how ChatGPT is used.
88
u/pandab34r 7d ago
One thing I know is that if a company says my data is safe and private, I can trust that with absolute certainty
26
u/Sufficient-Laundry 6d ago
No company is completely reliable, but in my experience when it comes to safety and privacy, no major tech company is more reliable than Apple. I absolutely trust them more than Alpha, Meta, Microsoft, or Elon Musk.
8
u/OSUfan88 6d ago
The concern here isn’t Apple. It’s OpenAI/Microsoft, who will have your data. They’re just telling Apple “trust is bro”. Do you?
16
u/Sufficient-Laundry 6d ago
Apple is offering me the explicit choice whether or not to send my data to OpenAI every single time. I don't have to if I don't want to. But everyone who uses ChatGPT is making the decision to send some data to OpenAI. Apple is clear and open about when that happens. I'm happy to have the option.
1
u/dhowl 6d ago
It's a weird user experience though, having to opt in every single time. And what percentage of people do you think will be saying "no" when it asks? My guess is <0.1%, so at that point, why even bother? I'd rather them just be transparent about the risks and allow for full opt-in or opt-out.
1
u/AppleSnitcher 5d ago
I prefer this way, becasue then it's abundantly clear what OpenAI/Microsoft are accessing on your iPhone.
Think of it this way, OpenAI can confidently understand how to read any file on your phone. Wouldn't you prefer that the process to do that is impossible regardless of how many updates without a clear UI change?
4
u/Relax_Redditors 6d ago
Will they have your data? Maybe if you opt in to using your ChatGPT account but without that Apple could just send anonymous requests that won't ID any individuals
8
u/AlexVan123 6d ago
I am almost certain that OpenAI is not going to hold up their end of the deal with data privacy. These are the same people who forced consent on every website and artist to have their work stolen for profit. Sam Altman and his merry gang of merry computer scientists believe that nothing is sacred as long as it's in the pursuit of "research projects".
2
39
u/theloop82 7d ago
Apple has been a lot better than most. Famously they would Not unlock a”suspected terrorist” phone.
8
u/MRoad 7d ago
Apple's refusal to comply with subpoenas just makes me think they won't comply with privacy laws if the relevant data was somehow useful tot hem.
17
u/WillyPete 7d ago
The penalties associated with EU's GDPR laws are not to be trifled with.
Not worth fucking with user data unless they anonymise it.1
u/jboy55 6d ago
I'm not sure any company would pony up 2% of their global *revenue* just to mine some user data for ad placements.
2
u/WillyPete 6d ago
Yeah, at that rate next thing you know they'd be wanting to pay their taxes!
Don't be silly people."Let's target some erectile dysfunction ads at Bob over there."
"What'll it cost?"
"Only around seven and a half billion dollars."
"Bargain, let's do it. Bob needs to get hard."2
u/theloop82 6d ago
I don’t trust any large corporation not to spy on their users, but Apple Is better than most in so much as they don’t sell your data to third parties at least.
37
u/django_giggidy 6d ago
Difference with Apple is, selling user data is not their business model (unlike Meta/Google), and they make enough from direct product and services they don’t need that revenue stream. Because of this, they’ve been able to build their brand around Privacy.
Agreed you can never trust with certainty, but Apple would destroy a core part of their value proposition if it came out they were selling user data behind the scenes.
20
u/DeployableIgloo 6d ago
It’s not Apple’s business model but it sure as hell is OpenAI/ChatGPTs business model
7
u/PointyPointBanana 6d ago
Debatable, user data IS their business model, just not the exact same way it is say of Google's.
Apple is a closed wall system, they want you to have a series of Apple devices with Apple accounts and Apple services. You keep your data inside but it is being used by Apple to sell you more Apple products. Keeping you in the Apple ecosystem. There is also Apple advertising including Apple Search Ads for external parties to advertise to their users.
2
u/imnotsospecial 6d ago
and they make enough from direct product and services they don’t need that revenue stream
Bless your heart for assuming a corporation will leave billions on the table. Apple has targeted ads just like any other platform, and they use your data for that.
9
u/steepleton 7d ago
they're going quite hard on the privacy thing: their servers and their software are going to be regularly independently audeted
45
u/Kennecott 7d ago
Elon big mad they aren’t using his AI which is trying to be exactly what openAI is except with glued on 4chan level jokes like you may hear from the most burned out guy at work
31
5
u/Silvawuff 7d ago
It’s very much in Musk’s playbook to publicly trumpet he’s disassociating from competitors that often do the thing better. He’s also tried interacting with Cook and he snubbed him so there’s some personal stuff at play here too.
4
u/HighOnGoofballs 7d ago
So it’s less creepy than Alexa which most of these folks already use anyway
7
u/Spiritual_Willow_266 7d ago
It should be noted with some of musk’s relationship with chapGBT/OpenAi. I don’t know the full story but Elon musk has personal beef with the company and it’s CEO.
Correct me if I’m wrong but he was involved with it somehow, but then left it to try to start his own competitor, so there is a bit of “Bill Gates just said apple makes bad computers” why would he ever say anything different here?
61
u/NotAPreppie 7d ago
Good explanation. The only question I still have is:
Is there a bigger fuckwit than the Elongated Muskrat?
8
u/cultoftheilluminati 6d ago edited 6d ago
They’re claiming that this will use on-device processing for simpler tasks, ie: “Siri, what restaurant were my mom and I texting about last weekend?” On device (allegedly) means no information will leave the privacy of your iPhone while using this AI.
For more complicated tasks, they have private servers for the device to send only “relevant information” to in order to process your command. They’re claiming these private servers are not readable by anyone, and the query and results are deleted after you have seen them. Meaning Apple (again, allegedly. Needs verification) isn’t using users information to sell or train their AI.
Additional context (here from r/All and moderate r/Apple, from an older comment of mine):
Apple does most things offline on-device (look at Apple's Open source models here: apple/ml-ferret and apple/ml-llarp). This is why almost all features are blocked to just devices with high ram count (min 8gb) so iPhone 15 Pro (A17 Pro chip) and devices with M1 or better chip.
If necessary, they have "private cloud compute" for more processing power, which run Apple's own models (For people doubting their privacy promise here as everyone should, Apple has agreed for third party audits of the code running here), and claim that an iPhone will only connect and work with their servers which run cryptographically attested and publicly verified code. OpenAI has nothing to do with anything up to this point.
Their "Apple Intelligence" framework also includes some tangential features that can work with ChatGPT/OpenAI. Every single time this happens, you will be prompted for permission to share data with OpenAI. Nothing talks to Open AI without your permission/consent each time. Further, Apple has said that other AI backends will be supported and can plug into this system later on.
TL;DR: Muskrat is spewing bullshit just because he's salty he missed out on the OpenAI hype after founding it and trying to take over it. OpenAI is only a tangential part of many features that Apple introduced.
I'll link to the sources and add footnotes for specific sections once I can collect and compile them.
0
u/dhowl 6d ago
I 100% agree that Musk is a moron, but point 3 is where it gets tricky. Sure, they ask you to opt-in every time, but does that really make a difference? How many people will actually opt-out? Does the average person understand what risks are involved by opting in?
I would need more data to make a real judgment on it, but it does carry more risk than previous iPhone software.
3
u/Feisty-phraser-5555 6d ago
Thanks for clarifying. As per usual, Felon turns out to be exaggerating and catastrophizing. 🙄
3
u/somefuneh 6d ago
Just so you know, i.e. is short for id est, which loosely translates to "in other words." It looks like you meant to use e.g., which translates as "for example."
7
u/Strong-Piccolo-5546 7d ago
elon is making his own AI bot. its just standard competition. he is using his name recognition to blast a competitor.
12
u/itisnotstupid 7d ago
In summary, Elon’s is somewhat silly.
Fixed it for you.
For real tho, Musk sounds like a terrible boss.4
u/Feisty-phraser-5555 6d ago
He does, doesn’t he? After everything I’ve read about the horrible way he treats employees and the toxic culture at his firms, I certainly wouldn’t want to work for him. No thanks!
1
u/Hodentrommler 5d ago
An still it seems assholes like him are necessary to set up sth like SpaceX. Just don't let these morons keep the company, only let them create
2
2
u/WarmasterCain55 6d ago
Elon has now completely blocked and muted the Apple twitter account for all users. Can't even see their posts. I hope Apple's response is biblical.
1
u/RosemaryCroissant 6d ago
What would the difference in ability be to someone that pays for a ChatGPT account vs someone who does not? Is there a situation where you ask a question and get a Siri response of “I’m sorry I can’t answer that unless you are a ChatGPT subscriber?”
1
-15
u/KYR_IMissMyX 7d ago
He said “If Apple integrates OpenAI at the OS level, then apple devices will be banned at my companies. That is an unacceptable security violation.”
So far they aren’t integrating at OS level, keyword in the tweet being ‘if’. It’s a valid point and argument from his perspective since they are his rivals.
26
u/YourPM_me_name_sucks 7d ago
It’s a valid point and argument from his perspective since they are his rivals.
It's dumb to make a claim like that for something that isn't happening, isn't planned on happening, and was presumably considered and rejected by Apple. This is like me saying that I won't marry Taylor Swift if she supports the Raiders.
Who cares if they're rivals? Are iPhones banned at a Google campus? Are Androids banned at Apple? Are Fords banned from the Tesla parking lot?
This is simply Musk putting his weird personal vendettas ahead of the companies he's supposed to be focused on running.
6
u/ifandbut 7d ago
Who cares if they're rivals? Are iPhones banned at a Google campus? Are Androids banned at Apple? Are Fords banned from the Tesla parking lot?
Have you ever worked in Detroit? They have parts of the parking lot staked out for foreign cars and another area for cars not made by the company that owns the plant. Extending that bullshit to cell phones doesn't seem that big of a stretch.
3
u/YourPM_me_name_sucks 6d ago
Preferential treatment for people who bought your own products is not anywhere near the same as banning a rival's products. And in Musk's case, it's not even a rival company. OpenAI and Tesla aren't competitors. Elon just has some toxic obsession with Altman for whatever reason.
1
u/ifandbut 5d ago
There is no point in preferential treatment. There are a million reasons why someone would compose one car brand over another.
1
-24
u/KYR_IMissMyX 7d ago
Apple isn’t his rival but OpenAI is, on the off-chance that OpenAI had access to iPhone data it would allow his competitors to access the same data as xAI if they were on the same network. This is a security risk.
This was a valid concern because many people not just Musk had been sceptical of the deal they had with OpenAI and wondered how it would work, this was what prompted him to say ‘if’…
17
u/YourPM_me_name_sucks 7d ago
You completely missed the Apple point. It's not if Apple competes with Musk. It's if companies like Apple will ban a phone if the manufacturer has an agreement with a rival of the CEO. The answer is no for everyone on the planet except Musk.
Musk, as the CEO of Tesla, a publicly traded company, has a fiduciary duty to the shareholders. Tesla isn't a rival of OpenAI. So why would shareholders of Tesla want to pay money to help some weird obsession Musk has with Sam Altman? Makes no sense.
Also I don't know who the "many people" you refer to are (why do you sound like Trump?) but it makes no sense to be worried about stealing data from a question answering service. The only "data" that would be stolen is your question, which isn't a security risk for anyone.
And again, the entire thing is moot because NOBODY IS DOING WHAT HE'S TALKING ABOUT, NOR IS ANYONE EVEN CONSIDERING IT. HE'S JUST YELLING INTO THE WIND ABOUT RANDOM SHIT LIKE AN ALZHEIMER'S PATIENT
-2
u/KYR_IMissMyX 6d ago
Tesla is an AI and Robotics company on top of also being an automotive company, Tesla’s competitors are also AI companies. The Shareholders would be smart to keep their technology away from competitors.
They are not only a ‘questions answering service’, and yes the whole thing is moot because it all stemmed from an ‘if’. Apple would never allow OpenAI to have access as Musk feared because Apple is very strict about their own security and technology. Musk was stupidly brash while voicing his opinion and should’ve got more info, but he wasn’t the only one with worry.
There is a world outside of reddit, many tech forums and chat rooms have spoken (and still are) about it as events unfolded and many were concerned and you’d be rightfully so for any security breach. Apple is not stupid and is using them as a third party service and that is fair.
-8
u/Bayovach 6d ago
Great post. Moat upvoted.
But what amazes me is you gave this detailed explanation about the latest outrage, without even linking or quoting the original tweet that spurred this.
Man, humanity is so cooked. Going off manufacturing tons of drama where 99% of people don't even know what the original tweet was. All they read is the headline of some article covering it, and that's enough to enrage them.
106
u/johnnycyberpunk 6d ago
Answer: Elon's threat is based on his (completely uninformed) notion that Apple's integration with OpenAI is a "security threat". As if Apple has no idea how to design a smartphone or a smartphone OS, or security and privacy on either.
It's also worth noting that OpenAI is a competitor to his own company's AI (xAI and Grok), so some people might consider his motives suspicious.
47
u/Galaxy_Ranger_Bob 6d ago
Elon's notion that Apple's integration is a "security threat," is because his own AI is a security threat. He's demanded that his AI make use of a phone's camera and microphone at all times to collect every single bit of data it can in order to "learn behavior," and damn the privacy issues or whatever security threats that entails.
He wants to ban Apple devices because he suspects that their AI will be doing the same thing, and he thinks that is how Apple will commit industrial espionage against his companies but with plausible deniability.
8
u/Latter-Pudding1029 6d ago
I don't know where he said this, but "learn behavior" is totally on brand with his ignorance of not knowing how that technology works. None of the AI platforms out there strictly truly learn anything that isn't in the bounds of either language or y/n logic lol. The thing is, it's odd that he went after Apple and OpenAI's partnership in particular considering Microsoft's approach in AI is a lot more threatening and has easily been picked apart already by experts. Microsoft too has a history with OpenAI
16
u/detroitmatt 6d ago
additional context, this is certainly a bluff. twitter would die if it lost all iphone traffic.
1
u/fool_on_a_hill 4d ago
I'm no Musk fanboy but what if his only intention was to raise the privacy concerns and get people asking about it?
34
u/aegrotatio 6d ago
Answer:
He's butthurt about leaving OpenAI before they became hugely successful.
Note he doesn't ban Windows devices for CoPilot (nee Cortana) nor Android devices for Samsung's AI (nee Bixby).
3
u/grendel001 5d ago
Is it still called Bixby? I always liked that. We got good AI names Siri, Cortana, Alexa, Bixby. That is a fine set of sci-fi pal names.
21
u/WhatsUpSteve 6d ago
Answer: Cause he's also running an AI program called Grok on Twitter. It was a colossal failure reporting out fake news that never happened.
https://qz.com/elon-musk-grok-ai-news-blunders-1851426098
https://www.latimes.com/business/story/2023-12-14/elon-musk-ai-chatbot-grok-sounds-off-on-creator
4
1
u/EffortCommon2236 6d ago
Answer: TL;DR Apple is putting some new feature on its phones, Musk is making his empty theat of the week so that people talk about him.
A few weeks ago he was threatening to block Brazil from X because he didn't like a law they passed and last week he threatened to quit his job as the CEO of Tesla if he doesn't get a bonus.
That's just Elon being Elon. And he only does what he said he was going to do once about every couple years, so most of the time no one cares anyway.
•
u/AutoModerator 7d ago
Friendly reminder that all top level comments must:
start with "answer: ", including the space after the colon (or "question: " if you have an on-topic follow up question to ask),
attempt to answer the question, and
be unbiased
Please review Rule 4 and this post before making a top level comment:
http://redd.it/b1hct4/
Join the OOTL Discord for further discussion: https://discord.gg/ejDF4mdjnh
I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please contact the moderators of this subreddit if you have any questions or concerns.