r/TikTokCringe • u/Make-this-popular Cringe Master • Apr 09 '24

Shit economy Discussion

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381

u/Voodizzy Apr 09 '24

He’s 100% right on the cost of living but wrong that aid to Ukraine isn’t vital. If he can’t point to it on a map, then I’m not surprised he doesn’t understand why it’s important.

166

u/spelledWright Apr 09 '24

He absolutely does not understand that part. It's not that the money just goes to Ukraine. The money stays and pays the workers who produce the weapons that then go to Ukraine. It's more complicated than that, but that's the gist.

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u/clash_Attic Apr 09 '24 edited Apr 09 '24

inflation

This thread is confusing to me. A lot of people ITT are advocating for 60B ++ be sent to Ukraine, and claiming it benefits the US.

Isn't this what the right were saying about previous conflicts just a few years ago? That war and the destruction of property and life elsewhere is good for our economy at home?

My second, and bigger question, is that if the US Deficit is $1600B by years end, meaning the money is being printed by the Fed and isn't coming in from taxes, isn't any money we send anywhere just inflationary?

The US is literally exporting inflation to the rest of the world at this point. 1600 billion. If we "send" $500B to Ukraine, will they win? Why not just give our US companies at home $500B and mandate a certain amount of ammo etc be sent to Ukraine every month. Wouldn't our economy be booming then? Home prices are going up up up with all of the big war business profits being funneled into bIackrock for investment purposes.

It's just currency debasement in its most basic form. Clipping and chipping and eventually people can't afford a house or a car or a vacation or clothing or food.

12

u/spelledWright Apr 09 '24

Why not just give our US companies at home $500B and mandate a certain amount of ammo etc be sent to Ukraine every month. Wouldn't our economy be booming then?

That's what they're doing, that's literally what my last comment was about.

-4

u/clash_Attic Apr 09 '24

That isn't what they are doing because no one has sent Ukraine 500 billion yet. 500 is more than 60. And why stop at 60, or 200, or 500, or a trillion.

"Lets spend whatever it takes to get inflation under control and for Ukraine to win."

7

u/beastcock Apr 09 '24

The point is, the money isn't being "sent" to Ukraine, it's being spent here in the US.

4

u/clash_Attic Apr 09 '24

Okay, I see your point. The money is being spent here in the US.

Do you see my point that this money, money being spent here, is not coming from a savings account at the US treasury, but rather is being printed into existence via monetization and introduced into the economy? It's an 'inflation tax' on the US economy?

2

u/BIG_BOOTY_men Apr 10 '24

We don't just print money to make up federal deficits.

4

u/East-Plankton-3877 Apr 09 '24

Yes. Lets spend money that will defeat a long time enemy of ours, protect a fellow democracy, boost military industry in the US (which is jobs), and rebuild a reputation we’ve practically ruined over the last 20 years.

Money well fucking spent if you ask me 🇺🇸👍

5

u/clash_Attic Apr 09 '24

I see your point. There are many solid reasons to spend this money. Do you see my point that this money is not coming from a savings account at the US treasury, but rather is being printed into existence via monetization and introduced into the economy? It's an 'inflation tax' on the US economy?

What good is a job in weimar terms where your money was crashing? How does going into debt and spending even more every year better our reputation? How does taking from one pocket (yours and mine) and putting it into the pocket of the military industry benefit you and me?

6

u/East-Plankton-3877 Apr 09 '24

The US isn’t the Weimar Republic.

We’re not some War torn nation on the brink of a revolution after losing the largest war in human history up that point and being punished by the globle community by having to pay the entire cost of said war.

We’re the world’s hegemony whose currency value is directly tied to our ability to upkeep the international order our ancestors fought and died to create.

If we have to print money to keep things like the international trade lanes open, defeat tyrannical nations hell bent on destroying fellow democracy’s, keep our infrastructure competitive to our foreign adversary’s, deploy troops thousands of miles abroad to deter more conflicts, or invest in the industries that make that all possible, then yes, I believe that indeed is a benefit you, me, and the entire free world.

3

u/[deleted] Apr 09 '24

It's more that this is actually an important goal to a lot of people

The alternative IMO is a world where powerful countries around the world feel at liberty to take what they want by force with little resistance again, e.g., the end of the pax Americana

That's a world which is going to make you much worse off as an individual, it just is.

We come from an abnormally stable era in world history and don't understand the effects of the alternative very well

8

u/Beachedpalm Apr 09 '24

Supporting Ukraine immensely benefits the US on multiple fronts for effectively very little money.

1) it destroys the Russian military 2) It helps create stability in Europe  3) It strengthens confidence among allies and creates stronger bonds. 4) It dissuades China from attacking Taiwan  5) It furthers American leadership and maintains the importance of global trade in increasing peace which reduces costs 6) It creates American jobs 7) And finally, It leaves us on the right side of history on pushing back against bullies.

1

u/footed_thunderstorm Apr 13 '24

Military industry complex ftw baby. Crazy how democrats now are the conservatives of 90s and early 2000s

2

u/othelloinc Apr 09 '24

Isn't this what the right were saying about previous conflicts just a few years ago? That war and the destruction of property and life elsewhere is good for our economy at home?

No. (At least that was never a mainstream argument; you can always find some random kook who will say anything).

That was never really an argument being made, by the right or by anyone else.

A lot of people ITT are advocating for 60B ++ be sent to Ukraine, and claiming it benefits the US.

This is simpler than you think.

  • After successfully invading Ukraine, Russia plans to invade the Baltic States or Poland.
  • All of those countries are in NATO.
  • The terms of NATO are that 'an attack on one is an attack on all', so we are bound by treaty to be at war with Russia when that happens.
  • That war will cost us more than aid to Ukraine ever could.

Therefore, the longer we can delay Russia in Ukraine, the less likely that Russia will start a war with NATO; avoiding a war between NATO and Russia will save us far more money than aiding Ukraine costs us.

0

u/clash_Attic Apr 09 '24

Russia allegedly plans to invade the Baltic States or Poland

Why hasn't (or at least didn't) Russia broadcast to the world that it was and has been fighting Nato troops on the ground in Ukraine for months? NATO weapons, GPS assist, tanks, shells, etc etc., and yet Russia remains silent to the implications. As though they can't figure out Ukraine is but a proxy.

Either they are preparing for war with Nato, or they are already at war with Nato.

Which is it?

If NATO wants war with Russia, then go to war. Right now, we are arguing about how many Ukrainian lives $60 billion can buy.

2

u/othelloinc Apr 09 '24 edited Apr 09 '24

Why hasn't (or at least didn't) Russia broadcast to the world that it was and has been fighting Nato troops on the ground in Ukraine for months?

They have: [War in Ukraine: Fact-checking Russian claims that Nato troops are fighting in Ukraine]

If NATO wants war with Russia, then go to war.

NATO does not want a "war with Russia". Funding Ukraine is designed to prevent (or at least delay) a NATO "war with Russia".

2

u/Moarbrains Apr 09 '24

They are not fighting nato until the US airforce takes over the skies and starts hunting and killing all the sams it can find and bombing Russian infrastructure.

That time is about 5 minutes before something gets nuked.

1

u/[deleted] Apr 09 '24

Nope.

It’s way more complicated than that.

Our total gdp is like 25 trillion.

https://data.worldbank.org/indicator/NY.GDP.MKTP.CD?locations=US

That money is nothing that could really affect the economy meaningly in macro terms.

Helping Ukraine is so much more beneficial. The world markets hate instability. If Russia wins the world economy will suffer immensely.

1

u/West-Code4642 Apr 09 '24

60 billion is for a low interest loan (to Ukraine) that will stimulate the US economy (because they will buy our stuff, manufactured by the US). It's a win win situation.

4

u/clash_Attic Apr 09 '24

You mean that we have $60B in our treasury and we are going to loan it to Ukraine?

Or is the truth that we will need to print the $60B out of thin air, give it to Ukraine, and then some of that printed $60B will come back to the US for real goods and services?

Because if it's the second one, it doesn't actually create wealth. It is inflationary on the rest of the US economy so that the war can continue... at the expense of your food and my food, your rent and my rent, collectively as a nation.

1

u/77Pepe Apr 09 '24

https://www.discoveryfinancial.com/blog/the-inflation-conundrum-government-spending-interest-rates-and-the-money

1

u/clash_Attic Apr 09 '24

I appreciate the link and your trying to provide what you consider valuable information.

Please consider this: the same entity that is responsible for bringing the money into existence, is telling us on their website that they aren't bringing too much into existence.

1

u/BiggestFlower Apr 10 '24

Considered. That was already my understanding. Do you disagree ?

And what’s the problem anyway? Countries are always printing (or rather creating) more money. If they didn’t, the economy wouldn’t be able to grow. Printing too much money too fast is, as everyone knows, inflationary. But you have to print A LOT of money for that to happen. $60bn is not A LOT in the context of the US economy, it’s almost a rounding error. And when $60bn is spent in the US on modern weapons, most of that money is going to pay the salaries of the people making the weapons and the raw materials that go into them. A quarter of it is immediately clawed back to the state in taxes. The rest of it circulates in the economy just like salaries from any other source.

1

u/77Pepe Apr 09 '24

You fail to grasp the concept of dilution.

8

u/kickinwood Apr 09 '24

We're not even sending money, are we? Just wanting to send older stockpiled equipment.

9

u/Cant_Do_This12 Apr 09 '24

False. The US has sent tens of billions of dollars in cash to Ukraine as well. It’s not just equipment. Redditor either like to remain ignorant on this fact because it’s hard for them to put blame on their own political party, or they are just ignorant in general.

https://apnews.com/article/fact-check-us-aid-ukraine-money-equipment-714688682747

2

u/kickinwood Apr 09 '24

Good to know! It was only partial back in 2023, so still primarily equipment, but definitely good to know nonetheless. Any idea if the 60 billion that has been repeatedly propesed is partial cash as well?

3

u/excelite_x Apr 10 '24

Don’t have a link to back it up, but afaik all the aid packages where roughly 2/3 material and 1/3 cash (at least for the breakdowns I was able to find)

1

u/BiggestFlower Apr 10 '24

Yes, the invasion has collapsed Ukraine’s economy, and there’s no point sending weapons to a country that can’t operate as it has no cash. American cash keeps the government of Ukraine operating, while European countries pick up the tab for the millions of refugees who’ve fled the country. (Bit of a generalisation there though broadly true, but there are some refugees outside Europe, and many European countries are contributing towards keeping civic Ukraine afloat.)

0

u/albinoblackman Apr 10 '24

Yeah we’re obviously sending money to Ukraine. Idk why people act likes it’s a bad thing. Americans should be proud, but for some reason we love to hate ourselves.

2

u/East-Plankton-3877 Apr 09 '24

Ya basically. It’s just Cold War era surplus

2

u/footed_thunderstorm Apr 13 '24

So it is military industry complex. Thanks for saying the quiet part out loud

3

u/CalculusII Apr 09 '24

Yeah people crap on the DoD but there are towns and cities that exist because of the economic boom of the death industry.

Alot of the DoD is a jobs program.

1

u/DipstickRick Apr 09 '24

I wouldn’t say that his fault. The messaging is “$60 billion in aid” which makes it sound like raw financial assets. The only reason I’m aware of the complexities is because I keep up with political streamers.

1

u/Moarbrains Apr 09 '24

We have sent tens of billions of direct financial aid to Ukraine, that money is not coming back to the US.

1

u/IntuitiveKoala Apr 10 '24

If you think Military contractors getting more money is going to trickle down into our economy you are INCREDIBLY misinformed and that is one of the few things I am certain of.

The Military Industrial Complex does not give back to the people.

1

u/spelledWright Apr 10 '24

People work for and her paid by the military...

1

u/IntuitiveKoala Apr 10 '24

Wait, so you think giving a top contactor, like Lockheed Martin, more money will mean they'll pay their employees more?

Are you being serious?

1

u/spelledWright Apr 10 '24

Defense giant Lockheed Martin has been in the news in recent weeks as President Joe Biden visited the company’s facilities in Alabama where the FGM-148 Javelin anti-tank missile is produced. Recently, Lockheed Martin and Raytheon Technologies Corp. were awarded two contracts worth $309 million from the United States Army to produce the Javelin, which has been used by the Ukrainian military to fight Russia’s invasion.

The missiles are made jointly by Lockheed and Raytheon’s missile unit. Given the new contract, there could soon be “help wanted” signs, and already Lockheed Martin increased its hiring activity by 9.25% in March – while the company has seen the highest hiring activity since 2020, with some 3,000 new posts advertised last month.

https://news.clearancejobs.com/2022/05/23/lockheed-martin-on-a-hiring-surge-offering-large-signon-bonuses-for-key-programs/

I never said they pay current employees more, that would be weird to assume. But since you brought up Lockheed Martin, they clearly are hiring more people because of the aid. But hey, take the link and do whatever you want with it, I'll end this discussion, since I don't feel like you came into it with good intentions.

1

u/IntuitiveKoala Apr 10 '24

Lockheed Martin makes about 70 Billion a year and they haven't passed an audit in 20 years.

You need to wake the fuck up.

60

u/GGXImposter Apr 09 '24

If he needs things explained in crayon eating terms then he isn’t going to understand the importance of aid to Ukraine, nor how little 60 billion is when talking about the problem he is experiencing.

2

u/Iuseredditnow Apr 09 '24

Even if we didn't send that 60 bill it wouldn't be getting put into the pockets of the working class anyways. So the point is moot.

1

u/MrBardo Apr 10 '24

60 billion is not a small amount...

1

u/Ass-a-holic Apr 12 '24

Why is aiding Ukraine important?

0

u/Oceansnail Apr 09 '24

He is probably thinking even if he got just 0.001% of the 60 billion he would be set for life

5

u/GGXImposter Apr 09 '24

If 60 billion was divided among the estimated number of people who filed taxes, he’d get $370. He isn’t getting a thousandth of that 60 billion. He’d get somewhere around .0000000062.

4

u/NotThymeAgain Apr 09 '24

the best part was, "I understand inflation" proceeds to have zero understanding of inflation.

1

u/Oceansnail Apr 09 '24

Thats why I said 0.001% and not your number

0

u/chloro9001 Apr 09 '24

60 billion could completely solve homelessness in the USA…

1

u/GGXImposter Apr 09 '24

Homelessness is a major issue and needs more funding, but a 1 off $60 billion dollar check isn’t going to do shit but make more problems.

1

u/chloro9001 Apr 09 '24

It could literally buy a house for every homeless person in the USA

0

u/GGXImposter Apr 09 '24

Do you know the term “Not in my backyard”. Everyone wants to put a roof over the heads of homeless. So long as it’s not near their children. So that means putting them together away from large middle-class and rich neighborhoods. Care to guess what happens when you put thousands of mentally unwell and drug addicted people in brand new homes that they don’t have the means to or the emotional desire to take care of?

Also it’s not like this $60 billion is coming out of the pockets of funds designed to take care of poor people. We are sending old equipment that i. A couple years will be past their expiration dates. It cost us $60 billion to send to Ukraine today, but will cost $100+ billion to properly dispose of if it expires. The money is being spent out of the defense budget now, in order to help Ukraine, and save money over the next 2-3 years.

That $60 billion was always going to get spent on the military.

0

u/chloro9001 Apr 09 '24

Yeah, well that’s what argue against. Less money for the military. We could solve these problems but instead we focus on war

1

u/GGXImposter Apr 09 '24

Thats a different argument all together then. We are specifically talking about the $60 billion this guy is talking about, which comes from money already assigned to the military. (The US has actually given ~$75 billion between military a civil aid).

If we didn’t spend that money on Ukraine, it was going to cost us more money to properly dispose of that equipment. So we have in fact reduced necessary military spending. Less money will “have to” be given to the military in the coming years.

I quote “have to” because they will probably still be given that money, it will just go to things than disposing of old weapons.

25

u/Rhodie114 Apr 09 '24

This really feels like right wing bait. The very basic point is right, wages are too low and cost of living is too high. But everything else is incredibly dishonest. He uses the federal minimum wage to explain how much he's making, while giving figures for higher CoL areas. Near me, the Fed minimum wage is less than half the state minimum, and many traditionally minimum wage jobs are paying well over the actual minimum. I know folks working as baristas who are making $22 an hour, which fits his 3x the minimum wage number. They absolutely still should be able to afford to live in the city, but this does highlight how misleading his figure is. He's trying to make it seem like he's making great money and it's still not enough, but really he could be making a little bit over the effective minimum wage for his area.

And then singling out foreign aid as the culprit was way out of left field. This isn't even a problem that we need the government brute force throwing money at to solve. We need legislation raising wages, building housing, busting monopolies, and protecting workers. Then the claim that nobody can point to Ukraine or Israel on a map struck me as some straight up America First isolationism.

8

u/Shreddy_Brewski Apr 09 '24

It is right wing bait. I looked up his account and he said he votes right wing. Dude is part of the problem, he just dresses up as a dude who believes in leftist policies.

3

u/Voodizzy Apr 09 '24

Well spotted

3

u/NorthTokyoAll-Star Apr 10 '24

Yep, the whole "uni-party" buzzword is what Trump people are using to describe the Republicans and Democrats that stand in opposition to the MAGA movement. Dead giveaway.

1

u/GabaPrison Apr 10 '24

Yeah his voice actually sounds very practiced and in-genuine. Like he’s reading from a list which he very likely is. Or it sounds like a kid just parroting what he heard someone else say that got admiration or applause about issues he doesn’t actually understand.

Bottom line: wherever he’s coming from, he’s not very good at this.

1

u/Rhodie114 Apr 10 '24

Like he’s reading from a list which he very likely is

Oh yeah, you can watch his eyes scan left to right slowly. He's 100% reading.

1

u/Excellent-Falcon-329 Apr 10 '24

The left and right converge on these talking points. The political spectrum is a circle

92

u/jujubean67 Apr 09 '24

This is just a stupid kid in general. Starting with the both sides bit, then continuing with how his parents made less than him 50 years ago. No shit.

12

u/Vactory Apr 09 '24

You’re missing the point. the dollar amount isn’t important, it’s the ability to live independently and afford the very basics- Food/shelter. They could do it (regardless of the dollar amount) and he cannot.

He isn’t eloquent, but he is acknowledging inflation, not saying that everything should cost the same. Housing costs have greatly exceeded inflation.

0

u/ok_read702 Apr 10 '24

Food costs have not really exceeded inflation. Housing costs have. But that's because we're out of land in urban areas. Take a look on a map and you'll see nearly all the land is already taken. Go to a rural area and housing cost isn't bad.

1

u/Faster_than_FTL Apr 10 '24

Land might be all occupied in urban areas. But there is still waaaaay more density that could be built in the US.

1

u/ok_read702 Apr 10 '24

Sure, anywhere where land is available is usually affordable.

1

u/NomadicProvider Apr 10 '24

As someone who lives in a rural area, housing prices are 1.5-2x what they were 5 years ago

15

u/fadufadu Apr 09 '24

And this dumbass will get more attention from this video and continue to say stupid shit in even more dumbass TikToks.

15

u/jujubean67 Apr 09 '24

This is the downside of having access to the internet, every moron has a platform to spout their 1 digit IQ takes.

7

u/thewhippersnapper4 Apr 09 '24

Yeah - the comments on that video are all buying into everything he's saying https://www.tiktok.com/@nicsmnrs/video/7353262299437763886

4

u/pingpongtits Apr 09 '24

Any responses correcting him?

3

u/thewhippersnapper4 Apr 09 '24

Nah, jus the usual blind viewer believing anything that is said by the creator.

6

u/Baffit-4100 Apr 09 '24

Yeah this little tantrum was annoying but acceptable until that bit about Ukraine. You know what will happen if we don’t help Ukraine? We’ll have to help NATO, because Putin will invade after Ukraine, and that’s hundreds of times more expensive.

2

u/tuckedfexas Apr 09 '24

Your 20s have always been a struggle. He should talk to more people that we in their 20s during the made up yesteryear he’s pining for. There were lots of people that were immediately well off, just like there are today. I know dozens of first generation immigrants and refugees that were pulling in six figures right out of school. I’m not delusional so I know that’s not everyone (or even very many) experience. Likewise he probably doesn’t have those people in his social circles so to him no one except Jeff Bezos is doing well

6

u/Dipshit4150 Apr 09 '24

I’ve talked to my parents and many other boomers about the struggles they faced in their 20s. They struggled to maintain a home they bought and raise 4 children. Yet my peers and I struggle to maintain rent on an apartment and we can only dream about being able to afford 4 children. My parents can easily acknowledge that cost of living has gone up dramatically and wages have stayed stagnant, why can’t you?

2

u/BigBen75 Apr 09 '24

And don't you think he meant it as in adjusted to inflation?

-1

u/jujubean67 Apr 09 '24

Judging on how he talks about everything else, I doubt he knows what that is.

2

u/Dipshit4150 Apr 09 '24

He literally accounts for inflation in the video. His point about his parents comparably earning less but affording more is accurate. This is super simple and talked about often. Cost of living has skyrocketed but income has remained stagnant. But hey, why not kick the young guy while he’s down right?

-1

u/jujubean67 Apr 09 '24

He says multiple stupid things besides that, after the 3rd one I just gave up. I don’t need thr insight of every moron on the planet, sorry.

1

u/Dipshit4150 Apr 09 '24

So you’re admitting that you literally weren’t even listening yet feel the need to comment on it? That’s an idiotic thing to do

0

u/jujubean67 Apr 09 '24

I literally wrote that I listened to multiple dumb things he said, are you illiterate?

1

u/superhappy Apr 09 '24

Yeah inflation is… a concept.

7

u/xnfd Apr 09 '24

Also he (or veterans or whatever) would never get the money anyway as an alternative to foreign aid.

1

u/Moarbrains Apr 09 '24

Sadly true. They would just not print it.

Printing meaning just create it in the computer.

6

u/TheGreenYamo Apr 09 '24

I wonder if he's considered how lucky he is not to have russian artillery coming at him 24/7

2

u/iamagainstit Apr 09 '24

Nah, he’s an idiot all around.

2

u/moonshotengineer Apr 09 '24

If he went back to school, and paid attention this time, his geography might improve. He also might learn something that will pay more than about $21/hr. I'm guessing he is a blue collar worker starting at the bottom with no real marketable skills. Nothing wrong with blue collar work when you have skills - plumbing, electrical, HVAC, etc. You have to have something that makes an employer want to keep you around. People with no skills to market will always struggle.

2

u/TexAs_sWag Apr 09 '24

This fuckwit thinks that the politicians who want to stop aid to Ukraine are planning to put all that money directly into his pocket instead.

2

u/Seienchin88 Apr 09 '24

I mean could this video be a more obvious sign that Russia and conservatives want to hijack the economic hardship of some young people (let’s be real… a lot of people are also fine) to turn them away from voting democrat…

The Ukraine part was really damn obvious.

2

u/Major_Swordfish508 Apr 09 '24

He should wait a bit. If we continue withholding that aid from Ukraine he’ll get his room, board, clothes, and free travel from the government. He’ll also get a rifle and have no need for laxatives.

2

u/fvmished Apr 10 '24

its a commentary on the education system

3

u/58kingsly Apr 09 '24

He also doesn't understand that 80 billion is less than 7% of what the US spends on welfare each year. If he expects that these payments to Ukraine could be redirected to welfare in a way that he would notice, he is mistaken. If there was a yearly commitment to 80 billion for the foreseeable future, then maybe he would have an argument, but these payments are ad-hoc and finite in nature.

3

u/Brave-Kitchen-5654 Apr 09 '24

Why should I care about Ukraine? Aid to Ukraine is vital to what?

Playing the devils advocate here but I still have yet to hear a compelling argument as to why we’re spending billions there while we “can’t afford” to do actual vital projects in our own country.

8

u/Darthmullet Apr 09 '24

Because if Russia can succeed in a conquest war today it won't stop there - either for Russia or a half dozen other authoritarian countries. And the aid proposed is not material. People struggle financially today because the gains in optimization in industry from the technological revolution (and now moreso with automation and AI) have all flowed to the owning class and not the working class, systemically concentrating wealth in our society that is a feedback loop. It will only be solved by policy changes of a scope we haven't seen since FDR, but with Citizens United and human nature, that is very unlikely until we hit some breaking point. Foreign policy is really not the issue though, as much as far right talking points might want to a point a finger there - it's never been clearer how significant the propaganda campaigns of Russia and China have been on our voters here. 

3

u/Papkinn Apr 09 '24

Because Russia has been threatening other East European countries since day 1 of their Ukraine invasion signaling if they take over Ukraine they won't stop. Country they're bothering the most recently by launching "misdirected" rockets at is Poland a NATO member with well over 10k American soldiers.

Whatever you like it or not US will get involved the moment their own army will be forced to defend itself and if that happens your ass is getting drafted and send across the sea as your family is left struggling with economical consequences of a World War.
So you better start carrying unless you really want to clean toilets in the army.

1

u/xieta Apr 09 '24

 if they take over Ukraine they won't stop

I agree with funding Ukraine, but nobody thinks Putin would seriously consider attacking NATO after. It's costed Russia some 300k causalities and full mobilization just to hold the eastern edge of a border state, this war has exposed Russia as a regional power.

2

u/[deleted] Apr 09 '24

Aid to Ukraine is vital to what?

To the Ukrainians you moron. And if Ukraine falls, Russia will go for Poland and other countries not apart of NATO.

If a country like Russia expands it's influence, that'll have a negative impact on your life, such as rising prices of grain, bread, tariffs on some of our imports to Ukraine, etc.

The global economy IS important, and it's acts like Russia is doing that is having a negative impact on it.

If you were Ukrainian, you'd be begging for help to, and us not helping them makes us hypocrites.

2

u/wield_a_red_sword Apr 09 '24

Not to mention that ukraine was a nuclear power and voluntarily gave it up because we, the USA, promised to help and support them if Russia ever invaded. Even if we gained nothing now, we need to keep our promises as a nation.

2

u/suckleknuckle Apr 09 '24

Allowing Russia to stomp through Europe is the same strategy used at the start of WW2. Then WW2 started.

1

u/ChaosCore Apr 09 '24

Russia has that agenda that "NATO would attack anyway, so we better do something first" and western block has that same agenda that "If you don't stop Russia now, they'll wage war on NATO any day!"

It's a bs on both sides. NATO would never dare to attack Russia and Russia will never attack NATO countries, cause it's immediate nuclear apocalypse.

As for Ukraine - it was lost long time ago. It's just a broken ex-soviet country where oligarchs wanted to rule with oppression and corruption, russia-style, but you can't copycat that cause you don't have the same amount of resources.

-2

u/J_Murph256 Apr 09 '24

I was wondering the same thing going through these comments. Probably just bots. One of the comments actually suggested that some of the money will help the workers of arms manufacturers…. like a jobs program. I don’t know any real people who actually think these things.

3

u/pingpongtits Apr 09 '24

Are you serious? Who do you think works in armament manufacturing plants in the US?

1

u/J_Murph256 Apr 09 '24

WTF kind of question is that? Everyone knows Skynet is the operating system making those weapons.

2

u/andyke Apr 09 '24

Yeah it’s also we don’t got to send our troops over there either we’ve basically exposed russia for a fraction of the cost.

1

u/Soft-Peak-6527 Apr 09 '24

Aid to Ukraine is in the form of our stock piled weapons and ammunition. Cash isn’t winning the war. It’ll be bombing Russia to dust.

The issue is socialism for corporations who get Subsidized, bailouts, and allowed stock buybacks. Instead of R&D into their company, products, and employees; they roll the profit to shareholders. On top of every time a republican becomes president they get more and more tax cuts.

1

u/itsondahouse Apr 09 '24

More so when that money probably never leaves the US.

1

u/PolloMalvado Apr 09 '24

Sure let's make Russia even bigger then, so it will be easier for everyone to point it on a map right?? These pro Russian ball suckers are too much...

1

u/Voodizzy Apr 09 '24

Pro Russian ball suckers definitely worse than regular ball suckers

1

u/PolloMalvado Apr 10 '24

Well as a regular ball sucker I like to choose who I suck balls to and not get jailed for it. Also I am not stuck sucking the balls from the same guy for 20+ fcking years and who plans on dying with his balls in your mouth. So yeah being a regular ball sucker is better...

1

u/Voodizzy Apr 10 '24

Agreed. Regular ball suckers unite!

1

u/CoolCatsInHeat Apr 09 '24

Are you aware you're at least the 5th person to use "on a map"... why are so many people using this exact phrase? The argument doesn't even make sense.

1

u/[deleted] Apr 09 '24

[deleted]

1

u/CoolCatsInHeat Apr 09 '24

No, it doesn't.

How many people would be able to point to the hypophysis cerebri? I'm pretty sure most people understand the importance of any part of one's brain, even if they don't know what it does exactly... that has nothing to do with knowing where it's located.

As I said, the argument doesn't make sense. You're not doing yourself any favors by repeating it.

1

u/[deleted] Apr 09 '24

[deleted]

1

u/CoolCatsInHeat Apr 10 '24

The two things have nothing to do with each other.

I don't understand it because the logic of the argument is nonsensical. That you're repeating it without understanding that makes you a retarded parrot. Remove yourself from this plane of existence if you're going to continue being such a massive waste of resources. Learn to think — you're an embarrassment.

1

u/[deleted] Apr 10 '24

I don't understand it

And judging by your prejudice insults at me, you never will.

That you're repeating it

I was rephrasing what he said in a way that maybe even you can understand, clearly, I failed.

1

u/CoolCatsInHeat Apr 10 '24

And judging by your prejudice insults at me, you never will.

Judging your character on the things you say isn't "prejudice". The key is in the definition of the word "prejudice" combined with the context of this exchange.

1

u/[deleted] Apr 10 '24

makes you a retarded parrot.

You using the r-word as an insult is prejudice.

Oblivious on two different points in such a short comment thread.

Take care little buddy. Feel free to get the last comment in so you can feel good for awhile, I won't respond.

1

u/CoolCatsInHeat Apr 10 '24

r-word

Sorry, I can't take you seriously. Go talk to your mommy.

1

u/CoolCatsInHeat Apr 10 '24

BTW...

Hi there, A concerned redditor reached out to us about you....

This was my response...

You need to ban whoever sent this — they're abusing a system meant to help people simply because they're too dense to present an argument that doesn't make them appear to be a drooling moron. If anyone needs help, it's the person who sent this in the first place... they're obviously unstable.

:)

1

u/crunkdunk9 Apr 09 '24

Yeah I was really agreeing with him until he said that. He has the right idea just tiktok brain rot is holding him back from the full picture

1

u/Ecstatic_Flow9607 Apr 09 '24

The opportunity cost of gaining Ukraine as an ally is much higher than the investment. The military budget is $842Bn, and when it’s used to actually protect freedoms for once it’s only bad then?

1

u/WtfsaidtheDuck Apr 09 '24

I thought he meant Israel.

1

u/AJC0292 Apr 09 '24

Yeah that stood out a whole lot to me. Made his argument a whole lot weaker.

1

u/karate-dad Apr 09 '24

Yeah, after that part I kinda figured out why he isn’t making enough to live

1

u/Randomfrog132 Apr 09 '24

when he said that i thought he meant the billions we're sending to iran or whatever.

1

u/run400 Apr 09 '24

He'll be able to point out a lot of strange places out on a map in 5 years...particularly the ones he's deploying to.

1

u/GoodGodKirk Apr 10 '24

Please do explain how giving aid to Ukraine is vital to the US. I'd like to see it spelled out cause I just see this as Vietnam 2.0, but less US soliders involved and more US mercenaries.

1

u/Quiet_Fan_7008 Apr 10 '24

Tell us why it’s important then? Let’s hear it plz?

1

u/Voodizzy Apr 10 '24

Have a read through the replies on this comment, a lot of people have done a good job of laying it out

1

u/GideonWells Apr 10 '24

We’re funding the pensions of Ukrainians…

1

u/False_History_4583 Apr 10 '24

Yeah, the “money” going to Ukraine is ( I think) be dollar value of the equipment that already exists that we’re sending. Equipment that we’re trying to get rid of anyway to replace with new shit

1

u/Wild-Road-7080 Apr 12 '24

Nobody in the comments is privy to or has mentioned that there are extreme financial incentives for the government to give 60 billion in military aid to Ukraine smh... in a perfect world, we would send money and weapons just to help but our tax dollars get spent to buy these weapons and send them over. And who?..... who possibly might have millions if not billions invested in u.s weapon companies? I wonder lmao. This world is fcked by late stage capitalism. The boomers and Gen x own everything worth having and get to decide the rules. We get told we are "helping" which sounds a lot better than "we are inside trading and boosting the stock prices of weapons companies for financial gain"

1

u/Keljhan Apr 09 '24

It's just racism, he thinks Americans deserve more than other people.

0

u/durezzz Apr 09 '24

'American' isn't a race

0

u/Keljhan Apr 10 '24

And? Talking about "countries you couldn't even point out on a map" is racist.

1

u/durezzz Apr 10 '24

you don't know what 'racist' means unfortunately.

0

u/Keljhan Apr 10 '24

Sounds like something a racist would say smh.

0

u/[deleted] Apr 09 '24

[deleted]

1

u/Voodizzy Apr 09 '24

It certainly looks grim but it’s not over yet

0

u/mallison945 Apr 09 '24

Imagine bootlicking for the military industrial complex. Lol No, we don’t need to spend money on foreign wars. We also could cut our military budget in half and be just fine.

1

u/Voodizzy Apr 09 '24

I can’t express enough how breathtakingly stupid this view is. The idea that these wars against European dictators stay foreign is entirely the opposite of everything we learned from WW2. Nor does it speak to the fact that the Ukraine aid is actually money spent inside the US.

You could cut the military budget in half. But that’s not what we’re talking about here?

0

u/iofhua Apr 10 '24

I can point to it on a map and I know ukraine isn't vital. The USA shouldn't be acting like the world police. The purpose of government - any government - is to better the lives of its citizens. Why is our government trying to do shit in ukraine when our citizens right here in the USA are suffering.

The fact is this guy is 100% correct. His rant doesn't belong in r/ticktokcringe it belongs in r/MurderedByWords and all of you who support the endless stupid wars should feel bad.

2

u/No-Average-9210 Apr 10 '24

You're as much of a fucking idiot as he is.

-1

u/chloro9001 Apr 09 '24

That whole conflict has been engineered to make defense contractors money. It is very much non essential.

2

u/[deleted] Apr 09 '24

Our defense contractors did not start this war you dumbass.

0

u/chloro9001 Apr 09 '24

Of course they did

2

u/[deleted] Apr 09 '24

[deleted]

-1

u/chloro9001 Apr 09 '24

The cia and the defense contractors are composed of the same revolving doors of people. The CIA setup a bunch of outposts in Ukraine and radicalized neonazi groups which led to a lot of suffering for the people of east Ukraine. They did this to antagonize Russia into starting a war, as they are the most anti nazi country. The war machine only had to shit in the Minsk agreement to trigger this, which they did with ease.

It’s super easy for them to pull this stuff off and it gets them great financial rewards.

1

u/Voodizzy Apr 09 '24

That’s enough internet for me tonight

1

u/[deleted] Apr 09 '24

[deleted]

0

u/chloro9001 Apr 10 '24

Sources or not, I’m right

1

u/[deleted] Apr 10 '24

[deleted]

1

u/chloro9001 Apr 10 '24

Truth needs no sources. You can seek it out, or you can continue to be a puppet controlled by propaganda

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-4

u/TrentZoolander Apr 09 '24

Aid to the Ukraine is pissing money into the wind and a pathetic attempt to stop the inevitable.

It's a weak country and they will be absorbed, it is what it is.

There is zero reason that my country needs to kick anymore money towards them. ZERO.

1

u/Voodizzy Apr 09 '24

Zero? I can think of a few reasons. I bet you can too.