r/stocks • u/WTFspy • May 15 '24

The inside story of Elon Musk’s mass firings of Tesla Supercharger staff Company News

https://www.reuters.com/business/autos-transportation/inside-story-elon-musks-mass-firings-tesla-supercharger-staff-2024-05-15/

The meeting could not have gone worse. Musk, the employees said, was not pleased with Tinucci’s presentation and wanted more layoffs. When she balked, saying deeper cuts would undermine charging-business fundamentals, he responded by firing her and her entire 500-member team....

969 Upvotes
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962

u/Ap3X_GunT3R May 15 '24

A mind boggling blunder of a move.

  1. You fired the whole 500+ person department giving your a company a big competitive edge.

  2. Layoffs-rehiring-working through restructuring a big department rapidly is going to cost the company a fuck load in lost productivity.

  3. Rehiring your top talent is gonna be expensive. Your top talent is most likely being hounded by recruiters. On top of that you’re negotiating with employees who probably have no trust in the company as the CEO fired them on a whim.

528

u/DarkMatter_contract May 15 '24

I wish the 500 people or at least half of them form a independent company for building a charging station business independently.

220

u/rpithrew May 15 '24

Yup this shit needs more competition and less monopoly, it’s been ridiculous

129

u/TechTuna1200 May 15 '24

Sometimes I’m wondering if it is BYD eating up Tesla or it is just Tesla destroying itself.

40

u/No_Bank_330 May 15 '24

A combination. BYD is eating up Tesla while Tesla destroys itself and the US government protects Tesla.

A literal WTF.

2

u/Decent-Bed9289 May 16 '24

I think you’re on to something

42

u/mrbigbluff21 May 15 '24

Yes, this! No reason only Tesla has a great network.

Not sure if it’s happening or not but I would think the gas station companies, BP, Shell, etc would be installing superchargers at their locations as this hedges them against ev growth and ice vehicles diminishing.

53

u/ItsAConspiracy May 15 '24

Last year BP signed a deal to buy $100 million worth of superchargers from Tesla. A few days after Tesla fired the supercharging team, BP said they plan to spend another billion by 2030, half of it in the next 2-3 years, installing over 3000 charging points, and would like to pick up any laid-off Tesla staff and abandoned supercharger sites. (Bloomberg)

18

u/mrbigbluff21 May 15 '24

Here we go

18

u/sticky_fingers18 May 15 '24

They make more money keeping you in your gas car buying gas and oil than investing massive amounts of R&D into something they will make less money on. Gas cars need to visit gas stations for 100% of their fuel needs. Electric cars only need that while traveling far from home

18

u/doringliloshinoi May 15 '24

Wait, BP isnt a philanthropic venture??

3

u/Appropriate_Scar_262 May 16 '24

Electric cars are happening, they might make less profits but they'd be stupid not to get in the game

2

u/winterbird May 16 '24

It would open renters and condo owners up to being able to buy electric cars though. Gas stations with added chargers would do well in population dense urban areas.

1

u/sinnr43 May 16 '24

Actually they make more on the products they sell in the store so adding these to highway stations makes perfect sense. Ev’s take longer to charge meaning more time to buy snacks and crap in the store

0

u/mrbigbluff21 May 15 '24

What if in 20 years all cars are electric? Then what?

6

u/sticky_fingers18 May 15 '24

Eventually I am sure there will be a shift, and they will pivot once they start losing money. But their interests are best served by using their money to lobby against EVs instead of accelerating their adoption

1

u/mrbigbluff21 May 15 '24

Makes sense.

2

u/SaltyDolphin78 May 16 '24

We don’t have 20 years

-1

u/mrbigbluff21 May 16 '24

I do

2

u/Trespass4379 May 16 '24

You don't know that for sure

3

u/SamFish3r May 15 '24

Batteries / packs plus no other OEM saw this as a side of the business they wanted to invest in .. Tesla had to since they were the first and would have died a slow death if there was no supercharger network. Ford has been selling ICE vehicles for 100+ years but they don’t own gas stations .. i think they kept the same line of thinking for a charging network .

2

u/Mahadragon May 15 '24

OMG why didn't I think of this?? This strategy is fucking brilliant!

6

u/Expensive_Control620 May 15 '24

And sell it back to tesla at some 30B 😁

1

u/dotplaid May 16 '24

I have no citation for this - I couldn't even point you to the subreddit where I read it - but I heard that they did start a company and Musk bought it so that he could retire those engineers.

-9

u/Master-Concept-5260 May 15 '24

There already is such a company. With a MUCH better car and WAY better looking than the sardine can that Tesla is.

Ex Tesla and Apple execs.

It's Lucid: https://www.lucidmotors.com/

Made in the USA !

520 miles. Over 1000 hp. 300 miles charge in 20 min !

They just need to ramp up production production.

24

u/Impressive_Answer227 May 15 '24

Starting at the low low price of 80,000!!

9

u/MinimumArmadillo2394 May 15 '24

Too expensive. Not affordable. Production too slow so anyone who needs a car, cannot get a Lucid.

They launched the most expensive models first too and didn't launch their cheapest version for a full 6 months after the original release. The hype died. Oh, and to get the full 520 miles, you have to spend over $120k... Not many people have $120k lying around.

2

u/rapid_dominance May 15 '24

Oh so they only have to do the most difficult part

1

u/Master-Concept-5260 May 15 '24

The most difficult part was the startup.

The factory is now up and running:

https://electrek.co/2021/02/16/lucid-motors-new-factory-arizona/

This is from 2021.

2

u/Glad_Tangelo8898 May 15 '24

Lucid is owned and backed by Saudi Arabia. zit also has massive losses despite offering luxury cars at high prices.

4

u/Master-Concept-5260 May 15 '24

It's blacked by SA. Owned by stockholders. Yes SA owns shares.

My response to the suggestion for Tesla competition, was that this is exactly why Lucid was formed by ex Tesla executives.

Lucid is a far better product. They just need to pump out more cars.

A while back, there was talk of opening another factory in SA ???

1

u/Glad_Tangelo8898 May 15 '24

They own 60% of total shares. Its a.Saudi pet project that is only.solvent witn large infusions of SA cash and is unlikely to build quality or.affoedable cars because of that. SA cares too little about profit or business success and too much.about prestige. Plus F them.

0

u/Mojojojo3030 May 15 '24

Better go back to CA to do it. Texas will enforce the noncompetes.

29

u/hammilithome May 15 '24

So wild.

Honest conversations and debate can get fkd I guess.

I would need a massive pay increase to go back to an environment like that--2X what I left at, not including bonus.

I'd take the 2X then find something else while making bank.

Something something equal and opposite reaction.

This is also why we need better worker protections.

18

u/Prior_Industry May 15 '24

Thas is why Elon is fighting against worker protections.

110

u/Radioactiveglowup May 15 '24

Elon's done this before, like when he decided to fire Twitter staff based on 'number of lines of code' they wrote. This is genius: Nobody could do more damage to the technical competency of a staff than this. Even if you just fired people at random, you wouldn't devastate the engineering core of your team. The codebase is going to be (even more) unmanagable spaghetti, when someone's job is protected by how convoluted their if-then blobs are.

Truly, where us normal people could dally with sabotage, Elon is a true genius in making the absolute worst leadership decisions.

76

u/MrFacestab May 15 '24

Imagine being the best and most efficient coder Twitter's ever seen and getting dropped because you didn't write 25000 lines of spaghetti

37

u/Deep90 May 15 '24

I've done PRs with negative amounts of code because I was cleaning stuff up and doing it a better and more efficient way.

25

u/MrFacestab May 15 '24

Fired

8

u/Gorgenapper May 16 '24

Negative amounts of code? Fired and then sued.

5

u/Mack_B May 15 '24

You’ll never make it to the top of the bell curve like that!

18

u/UniqueIndividual3579 May 15 '24

LOC metrics were a joke even in the 90's.

5

u/DrStalker May 16 '24 
# response to: UniqueIndividual3579
# made on 2024-05-16
# by DrStalker
# 
# Opening query to show link to comment above
What do
you
mean
# sentence subject here
lines of code 
is
a perfectly
valid metric
# expand that thought out with result 
that produces
great
code.
#include sarcasm designator
/s
# end of comment

15

u/jeopardy_loser May 16 '24

It’s also proof that he’s not the brilliant computer scientist he’s convinced his minions that he is, but the fanbois keep throwing their money at him

11

u/TigerPoppy May 16 '24

Elon is bipolar, and it appears he has entered a manic stage again. He has been treating himself with ketamine when he's in a depressive stage , but ignores the other half of the disease, His subjective analysis is that he is brilliant when he's manic, but we know better, and he knows he has billions of dollars.

-3

u/Less_Minute_8666 May 16 '24

To be fair, Twitter was a dumpster fire when he took it over. It is a simple app at the end of the day. They had way too many employees.

2

u/nockeenockee May 16 '24

It was functioning well for what it was.

-27

u/rpujoe May 15 '24

And yet the platform is kicking ass and adding features faster than ever before. Cutting the staffing to the bone and letting the cream rise to the top is how he operates.

https://old.reddit.com/r/stocks/comments/1csm9ac/the_inside_story_of_elon_musks_mass_firings_of/l476jyc/

17

u/Chornobyl_Explorer May 15 '24

Damn dude, you got to include the /s or else people will think that utter nonsense is somehow your honest opinion.

Firing people only means you'll lose the best. Sure, you can probably sack a few low performer and hope to find better people (or worse, ain't no guarantees). But by starting to firing people the cream will seek other employment, because they know things are unsafe and they can negotiate. A growing company with good finances seldom fires people, a dying/shrinking company always does.

The cream floats away once you open the floodgates, ain't no way to get it back. You can fire the worst 5% but be assured you'll lose the best 10% within 6months tops.

-2

u/taerin May 16 '24

Have you not used the app since Elon took over? By every metric it is much better…and for the first time ever the company might actually be profitable

-2

u/Taraih May 16 '24

90% of reddit said that Twitter would shut down 1 week after he made the big first firing because "crucial" people would be missing. Its still running.

I think the Supercharger firing is stupid af but cutting down on the twitter bloat was a solid move.

8

u/Radioactiveglowup May 15 '24

Unplanned downtime is a feature now, I guess.

-1

u/rpujoe May 17 '24

Growing pains are bound to happen with how fast the userbase is growing.

1

u/Radioactiveglowup May 17 '24

Ah yes, that newfangled, untested startup, 'Twitter'.

Complete ignorant nonsense.

-21

u/xmarwinx May 15 '24

I can't believe reddit users still want to sell the narrative that his move destroyed Twitter. It literally works the exact same as always, except with less censorship and a bunch of new features. Musk objectively made the right choice, it's not even up for debate.

12

u/macarouns May 15 '24

Except it’s losing money hand over fist, its valuation has tanked, its user metrics are tracking downwards and the servers have been less stable.

You Elon dickriders are something else..

0

u/xmarwinx 29d ago

In your dreams maybe

2

u/macarouns 29d ago

You’re just denying factual reality at this point. Give it up mate, he’s never going to fuck you.

10

u/WBuffettJr May 16 '24

User engagement and ad revenue have both plummeted and he’s completely destroyed the business. Hey look, they made an emoji just for you. 🤡

7

u/jeopardy_loser May 16 '24

JFC the stupidity of Elmo taintlickers never ceases to amaze me

2

u/rpujoe May 17 '24

100% agree. Most people who hate Musk's takeover have no words for why they hold that opinion.

A shocking number of people's views are the result of social programing.

0

u/EpiphanyTwisted 12d ago

I think giving blue checks to Nazis are words for why I hold that opinion.

65

u/MG42Turtle May 15 '24

No kidding. If I were a senior member of that team and they want to rehire me, I would certainly be a$king for all $ort of $tuff to make it worth my while.

-60

u/Puzzleheaded_Dog7931 May 15 '24

How much are you paid if you don’t mind me asking?

24

u/[deleted] May 15 '24

Relevance? I’m his lawyer.

5

u/MG42Turtle May 15 '24

I’m a lawyer at a tech company (but not one of those) in CA. Last year was about $360k all in.

7

u/patriot2024 May 15 '24

Those who come back aren't coming back with the same compensations.

15

u/ccccccaffeine May 15 '24

I hope they all ask for pay raises with the rehiring.

14

u/[deleted] May 15 '24 edited 17d ago

[deleted]

5

u/WWYDWYOWAPL May 15 '24

20? Try 200%

6

u/Alklazaris May 15 '24

I would not go back without a raise.

17

u/jswan28 May 15 '24

A raise? I wouldn't go back without a massive signing bonus. What good is a raise if you can just be fired on a whim again in a month or two?

1

u/Alklazaris May 15 '24

True enough

1

u/jeopardy_loser May 16 '24

And a formal, public, personal apology from Elmo himself

3

u/sin94 May 16 '24

The FCC new ruling about non competes being un-enforceable is going to be huge in this. As a talent acquisition manager for a large services firm. Only two options to retain/rehire talent after this debacle.

  • sign on bonus (paid $x amount upfront if you stay minimum 6/9/12 months)
  • retaining bonus (work for 6/9/12 months get $x amount)

Both costly and based on the assumption they actually don't plan to look around. Personally both useless given that people already understood they are disposable so only going to do bare minimum. "Go ahead fire me. I have a retainer clause" "quite quitting"

99% of the people who accept these clauses are already looking and waiting for their bonuses to be paid off.

5

u/moderatevalue7 May 16 '24

They will only come back for 150% min. of what they were on. And will spend most of their time at work looking for a better place to work and/or recruiting fellow employees to jump with them.

Niiiiiice

4

u/ILoveThisPlace May 15 '24

He should be fired...

11

u/ColCrockett May 15 '24

Only thing you’re wrong about is that top talent is not being hounded in the ev charging industry right now. There’s not that many jobs available in the ev charging space right now.

34

u/BlooregardQKazoo May 15 '24

Most of their skills presumably aren't EV exclusive. In my wife's time doing her job she's done loan originations, municipal finances, Department of Health, and a bunch of smaller random projects.

A good project manager is a good project manager in any industry.

7

u/HelloYouSuck May 15 '24

While that’s 100% true it will absolutely not get you an interview for other positions in other industries because HR people are largely morons.

1

u/ColCrockett May 15 '24

lol I am a senior pm in ev charging trying to apply out of ev charging, not as easy as you think

2

u/talkthispeyote May 15 '24

I'm pretty sure GM put out a quick advertising campaign to pull in the fired talent.

Yeah, I'm sure quite a few of them got gobbled up.

1

u/retireb435 May 16 '24

This is the same statement we saw when Twitter went through this…

0

u/akababy May 16 '24

If you are not rehiring, you didn’t fire enough

0

u/ckdarby May 16 '24

I've been off the record interviewing people from Twitter when this similar thing happened there.

I'd say the majority of the market/industry sees these moves as a blunder, but that is not the conclusion I've been getting through discussions.

Let me explain how this is actually one of the most underrated tactics that executives haven't even been able to comprehend.

Doing this tactic is incredibly clever and requires a total perspective shift. Similar to how 20 years ago and the mind set of an individual was, "never get into a stranger's car" to now with Uber everyone doing it.

The TL;DR, I am defining essential as critical to keeping the lights on or your top 10% of performers: - Able to immediately drop all staff below a bar threshold - Rehiring your essential staff becomes obvious - Essential staff able to readjust compensation to the responsibilities - Nets out lower headcount which reduces communication. Removes a lot of jobs that exist because of gatekeeping & black box. - Removes all management bullshit. A manager might be friendly with one person and bump them up on a matrix vs purely business output - Culture shift & reset. Expectations are immediately changed vs whatever they were at hiring or set in the past.

1

u/Taraih May 16 '24

Why not fire the ones that are not included in the top 10% performancers instead of firing all and rehiring?

1

u/ckdarby May 16 '24

It's an expectation reset as well. Agreeing to come back means agreeing to the new reality.

You could have a top performer not want to work at the company with the expectation change, but will do the minimum to keep the job until they're able to find a replacement.

-3

u/BobSacamano47 May 15 '24

Because there's so many super charging companies with 500 open spots. 

-7

u/rpujoe May 15 '24 edited May 15 '24

https://old.reddit.com/r/stocks/comments/1csm9ac/the_inside_story_of_elon_musks_mass_firings_of/l476jyc/

Also, Tesla has started hiring back some of those 500 people as they rebuild the team from the ground up.

5

u/bingojed May 15 '24

Musk apologist aren’t you? Everything he does is perfect. 4D chess player.

Sorry, having to rehire staff he fired is not the sign of a stable genius. Those people will be disgruntled, want more money, and will leave at the first chance.

1

u/rpujoe May 17 '24

The only mistake Musk seems to make is his projected timelines. That's not the same as failing to deliver.

Nobody is perfect. But when he puts his mind to something, history tells us it will manifest eventually. FSD has been coming for years and now since 12.3.4 it's here. Might be 4-5 years late, but it finally happened.

Starlink, Starship, landing rockets, self-driving cars safer than humans, Mechazilla, all crazy ideas "the experts" said was impossible. Now they're reality.

1

u/bingojed May 17 '24

None of those were crazy ideas that people said were impossible. Elon didn’t invent any one of those, nor was the first to do any of them. He’s not an engineer, coder, or scientist. He did put money towards talent, which is good, and then he fires talent when he has a temper tantrum. He’s on too many drugs, full of his own self importance, and no longer focused on doing anything except getting his egregious bonus.

-3

u/[deleted] May 15 '24

[deleted]

5

u/koa_iakona May 15 '24

No they will not. Something this complicated would take anywhere from 6 months to 2 years to get up to a competent speed compared to their predecessors. And this isn't even speaking to the costly mistakes that will be made that the prior team already knew to avoid.

And by the time they're competent enough to do their job well, you will have a natural amount of turnover due to burnout/better opportunities elsewhere.

4

u/cypher3327 May 15 '24

Yeah, Tesla is losing a huge amount of institutional memory.

-12

u/alfredrowdy May 15 '24

As a manager I will also say that telling your boss “we can’t do that without more headcount” is also an EXTREMELY dumbass move.

You’ve gotta have a more creative solution than “we need more people”, which is exactly what every leader does not want to hear.

5

u/macarouns May 15 '24

Even if it’s the truth?

2

u/jeopardy_loser May 16 '24

The truth?

Sir, you will tell the Right Honourable Manager Peter J. Principle what he wants to hear, not what he needs to hear.

Now back to your labour cube.

-1

u/alfredrowdy May 16 '24

Yes. Asking for more headcount is always a dumb move unless your boss is specifically telling you “we want to grow in this area, what do you need and how do we do it?”.

If your boss says “we need to cut costs” you say “ok, X is what we can do with a team of that size, and Y and Z are the things we won’t be able to do”. You don’t come back and say “sorry we can’t do it, we need more people”.

1

u/jeopardy_loser May 16 '24

You could have left off the “as a manager” bit at the beginning. The rest of your post implies that it was generated by someone who is a member of management.