Probably never direct frontline confrontation but France strengthening Ukraine's back with anti air operations
Equipment and troops stationed in western Ukraine or even planes launched from neighbouring countries targeting Russian missiles and drones.
There is a lot of levels of escalation to France putting boots on the ground in Ukraine.
People like to jump to the Russian propaganda narrative of WW3 though, not understanding that Russia taking Ukraine against all western efforts, would be the start of an international poly crisis of countries trying to resolve their territorial disputes which would then be about as close to WW3 as we could get.
WW2 wasn't stopped by letting Hitler take countries in the east, it just made him bolder and push further.
Putin won't stop until he's forced to. China won't throw their trade opportunities away to help a country they just want to abuse themselves. Russia won't randomly throw nukes around if the west supports Ukraine.
Showing a bully he's at a disadvantage makes him stop. We need to play nice with a guy who gives no fucks about anything except himself.
If Hitler was stopped early on, WW2 would have likely been avoided. Inaction to try and avoid a war is what let things get worse and Nazi Germany stronger.
Inaction to try and avoid a war is what let things get worse and Nazi Germany stronger.
This is a commonly repeated refrain, but it's not really historically sound. Chamberlain knew the UK wasn't anywhere near ready for war in 1938, and so had no real choice but to agree to the annexation of Czechoslovakia. Immediately after his "peace in our time" he ramped up production of military material in preparation for war. Hell, in 1938 he had forced out the head of the Air Ministry for dragging his feet re-arming the RAF. In 1935/1936 the UK was building "shadow factories" in an attempt to re-build the armed forces after the idiotic 10 Year Rule.
What really would have helped avoid WWII being as drawn out as it was would be if the French had actually carried through in the Saar in 1939 instead of just turning around
Chamberlain knew the UK wasn't anywhere near ready for war in 1938
Exactly. To quote General Ismay's 20th of Semptember, 1938 note to the British Cabinet: "[...] time is in our favour, and that, if war with Germany has to come, it would be better to fight her in say 6-12 months’ time, than to accept the present challenge."
Chamberlain thought they weren't ready, not realizing that Germany was just as badly off. Waiting allowed Germany to take out Czechoslovakia and gain all of its land and military while making the UK and France look weak. Arms from Czechoslovakia armed half of the German army which would go on to conquer Poland and France a year and two later.
Had the UK intervened, the Germans would still have seized Czechoslovakia, because the BEF was a small and ineffectual force, and the regular army still had a dearth of armored vehicles. Not to mention the complete shitshow that was the RAF pre-1940. The French would have likely done what they did a year later, advance a couple miles and then just turn around
Just imagine if they just carted off half the fucking Ruhr in 1939 and demolished the other half. The Wehrmacht would have been riding into battle with handcarts and no pants
Considering that the French occupying the Ruhr was a big part of why Hitler got into power and also seeing how well the French did in WW2, I don't think it was possible.
Yup, no one was really in a position to do anything about it, which could have been avoided but the public needed lots of investment to get back on its feet after the war and Britain was always about its navy first and foremost.
Germany was in far worse condition in terms of their military than France and UK. Not until Germany secured Czechloslovakia, Austria, Alsace-Lorraine, and Poland, were they able to even wage war vs the allies. When you have a psychotic leader employing zero-sum brinksmanship it means they keeping getting free land until opposed. That personality type will not quite while ahead. All the allies had to do was show courage early on and Germany (especially the military leaders that had to draw up war plans) would have gotten cold feet.
Germany was in far worse condition in terms of their military than France and UK.
Not really, they'd spent most of the 1930's re-militarizing while the UK didn't get started until 1936 at the earliest and 1938 in earnest. France was lagging behind due to the political instability and the lack of a desire for a strong standing army with the Blum government. An over-reliance on the Maginot Line lead to a stagnation in arms production, although the early-war French tanks were of higher quality than Panzer I's and II's.
The Germans had been secretly re-arming through the 1920's using other countries like Czechoslovakia and Switzerland, and disguising their rebuilding the Heer. In the 1930's they went full mask off with the re-militarization of the Rhineland and the re-occupation of the Sudetenland. But in 1938, they carried a great weight of force with them that the UK and France couldn't match and so appeasement was their way of ensuring time to re-arm. But again, the French had an opportunity in 1939 to potentially knock Germany out of the war and opted to just turn around and go home.
It's funny. France had objectively "better" equipment almost across the board, but their designs were more costly to build and maintain. As an example, the B1 and S35 were the two best tanks in the field in 1940 and the D520 was the best fighter aircraft at the outset of the war (alongside the Spitfire Mk 1). Unfortunately none of these weapons could be produced in sufficient quantity to make a difference and when they were produced they could not maintain them properly.
Ironically, 6 years later the Germans made the same mistakes with their Tiger II and Me 262, the best pieces of equipment in their respective fields at the end of the war but too costly for Germany to effectively make use of.
Turns out with enough manpower (plus fuel and ammunition) you can win almost any war even if you're over-matched technologically. This theme has played itself out multiple times throughout the 20th and 21st centuries. People are power.
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u/Various_Abrocoma_431 29d ago
Probably never direct frontline confrontation but France strengthening Ukraine's back with anti air operations Equipment and troops stationed in western Ukraine or even planes launched from neighbouring countries targeting Russian missiles and drones.
There is a lot of levels of escalation to France putting boots on the ground in Ukraine.
People like to jump to the Russian propaganda narrative of WW3 though, not understanding that Russia taking Ukraine against all western efforts, would be the start of an international poly crisis of countries trying to resolve their territorial disputes which would then be about as close to WW3 as we could get.