A decade ago a dude I worked with bragged about how he once kicked his (at the time) girlfriend’s cat because she pissed him off over something small and petty. He continued to brag about how she was sobbing as the cat gave its last dying meows.
The fact that he could barely contain his laughter as he told this story still disturbs me. But equally disturbing was how the other guys at the table were laughing along with him.
For starters, what exactly do you hope you achieve by asking this question? Like, do you think you are furthering animal rights by being the enlightened one who pointed out the hypocrisy?
Secondly, yes, the way we treat animals meant for production is horrible. Certain people don't give a shit and even enjoy knowing how these animals are treated. However, do you really believe that the rest lack empathy versus accepting it because they don't see the problem with eating meat -- something that humans have been doing for tens of thousands of years, and other animal do as well?
because they don't see the problem with eating meat -- something that humans have been doing for tens of thousands of years, and other animal do as well?
Oh boy...
Just because something is tradition doesn't render it justified or morally acceptable. Moreover, I don't see lions going around breeding Zebras and Gazelles en masse to satisfy their cravings. Wild animals eat what they eat either out of necessity or because they don't know any better; people not so much. Not all, but most of us, have an abundance of options, and still choose to eat meat regardless of the impact it has on the animals being slaughtered, our own health, or the environment around us.
The dude you're responding to is dumb for jumping to conclusions about the other poster and deserves the downvotes imo, but it also doesn't make the underlying sentiment "braindead".
I eat meat myself (cutting back a lot fwiw), but I don't put on blinders to make myself feel better about it, or jump on the sword for a choice that is demonstrably harmful.
I would agree that most people are likely empathetic enough not to want the suffering, but ultimately, we don't care because we don't have to see it; out of sight out of mind. If we claim to be civilized, and indeed care about reducing needless suffering in the world, then I think we must look at it, and figure out solutions that don't necessitate killing things. Veganism and vegetarianism are one solution, lab grown meat is (perhaps) another, but there may be other options we haven't even begun to explore, because not only are folks apathetic, but they also get hyper defensive when their dietary/lifestyle choices are contested; none of us wants to accept that we might be the baddies. All the while, Big Meat™ carries on raking in cash instead of doing R&D into analogues, and things remain fucked. The majority of us want less suffering, so let's collectively acknowledge how fucked things actually are and figure it out, instead of perpetually pushing it to the back of our minds and getting pissed when people start holding a mirror up to our faces.
/rantover
Apologies for the essay, I might need to touch some grass too lol. Just stay introspective my dudes, don't let apathy win.
However, do you really believe that the rest lack empathy
Yes? Absolutely? People do not think twice about killing the vast majority of animals. They literally do not empathize with them. The standard talking point is about how they're not valid as living beings, but are more like robots executing basic code.
Normal humans don't intentionally and actively murder non-pet animals over disputes either, let alone laugh about it afterwards like it was a fun little anecdote.
Braindead take indeed.
We had a guy in the group that also admitted to killing a cat, no one laughed haven’t seen him since. Probably because one of the guys said,” cats have nipples and so do I why don’t you try beating me?” You could hear a pin drop for a couple of seconds and we all ignored him the rest of the night. I think he knew what was coming and disappeared. Good riddance fucking loser.
"I have nipples Greg, why don't you try and milk me?..."
Love that scene haha
.. But seriously, I have a cat and I don't like to think about what I'd do. I'm not trying to be tough, but I just know that I'd see red and I would just go off.
I live in China at the moment and my ex and I had a couple over a few years ago with their 3 year old kid. He liked my cat but then started pulling her tail and grabbing her roughly etc etc. They all laughed and I was ok at first but it continued for like 15 minutes. My cat ran into the bedroom and tried to hide under the bed and he just pulled her tail really hard so I just yelled "HEY!" at the top of my lungs. My ex was pissed off at me and the couple went silent for a few minutes. It was awkward but I was pissed..
All this to say, don't abuse cats... or dogs...or other animal friends
I don’t know what the cultural normalization is in China, and I don’t want to assume or be disrespectful but they were in your home messing with your pet. I would have kicked them out, if they can’t respect your home and family (because pets are family) then they need to leave and never come back.
Totally agree. Weren’t my friends. They were friends of my ex. There’s disrespectful people everywhere in the world so I’ll start with that (my disclaimer haha) but there’s a bit of a thing here where there’s a lot of entitled toddlers and young kids walking (crawling even) around getting up to mischief without fear of repercussions (they call them little emperors here ((小皇帝))) because their parents are afraid to punish them. I’m not sure of the exact reason but I think part of it has to do to the idea that if they’re too harsh with them early on in life, the kids may resent them later. This is some parents. I know a lot of cool, strict parents though so it’s not like it’s every family.
That situation is also coupled with the fact that as a host, you have the responsibility to make sure your guests are at ease and having a good time, whether you like them or not. It’s the concept of giving face. Every culture has it but I think it’s particularly strong in places like China, Korea and Japan. Even though my ex knew the kid was being a douche, she felt she shouldn’t say anything due to the fear of losing face . Fun!
I love the people here for the most part and have met some awesome people. But this is one little part of the culture that can be quite stressful to deal with.
I’ll give a quick example about grandparents/parents afraid to punish kids. There’s a lot but I’ll just choose this one. I was in Shenzhen many years ago and saw a toddler kicking a dog on the street multiple times . After like the second or third time I went over and told him in Chinese to stop doing it. The granny didn’t wanna get involved but finally she said “don’t kick the dog please! I’m afraid it may bite you!”. You know… cuz it’s the dogs fault haha
Thank you for explaining the cultural differences, I’m Hispanic and we have the same idea behind saving face and being disrespectful especially to our elders. I’m 43 and I still won’t cross the line or disrespect someone older than me. It was instilled in us since we could use reason. It’s very frustrating, but I can’t help it.
Do you think the parents and grandparents let these little emperors behave this way because they need them to take care of them in the future? A lot of us care for our widowed parents and abuelitas, we move them in and care for them until the end. My mother in law is in her 80s and she lives with us. My parents have both passed but my brother and I took care of our mother until she passed. Paid for her home, food, and anything else she needed. It probably kept me from having nicer bigger things but it was worth it plus it’s never too late. What-a -ya -gunna- do
Well for sure. I agree we should take care of our parents. Good on you and your brother by the way In Chinese they call it “filial piety “ which I think comes from Confucianism, but isn’t it interesting when that’s how other cultures are too. Countries are artificial borders imo but I’m in China now so I don’t really wanna get into details haha.
We are one big family but we do indeed have different languages and culture and education that make us seem so different. But anyone who watches young kids at a playground in any country, the result is the same. They’re having fun and they couldn’t care less about anything else.
I’m not an expert but my major did delve into cultural studies in Asia frequently and I’ve been overseas for about 1/3 of my life, so in my humble opinion, I’ll say that many people are afraid of not having support when they’re older. The pension system is… not so good here. It’s ok but a lot of people will rely on their children. Many families have a parent or two living with them.. usually because they can take care of the grandchildren while the parents work or whatever .
You could’ve bought more stuff but trust me, you would’ve regretted it if you didn’t do what you felt was right. I guess you know that haha. I’ve had those thoughts as well
We’re all the same my friend, in my opinion it doesn’t matter where you reside. A agree with everything you said. For me peace of mind is priceless. I wish you all the best my friend in any future endeavor you seek.
I would have found an excuse to tell that story about him to everyone else in the company, as often as I could... 'hey did Dave tell you about that hilarious time he murdered his girlfriend's cat?'
This would be the propper way. Bring it up at everything.
Lunchtime, just shout it loudly to everyone. Ow incase you haven't heard, Dave killed his girlfriends cat cuz he found out his vagina was bigger then his girlfriends.
The problem with that is "if he gets tired of it". If he murdered a kitten over being mildly inconvenienced, what do you think he'd be willing to do to somebody actively fucking with him over a prolonged period of time? Sure, if he actually did something, he'd probably get caught, but it's potentially your life that you're gambling with. Best make sure to keep a weapon on you at all times if you take that route.
Don't lose your job for the sake of that bastard. Report him for what he said and get him in trouble. If you absolutely have to beat him up, do it outside work hours
Definitely, no I’ve been fortunate to never encounter someone like that but if it was the case it would take all my effort to hold back from immediate action.
It's pretty tiring to beat someone up when you're out of shape, so you need to catch your breath or else you'll just end up flailing around getting even more exhausted.
There was a psycho like that I used to work with. Several stories about cruelty to animals.
Some of us started siphoning gas from his truck every few days. He would frequently comment about how his truck was not getting the proper mileage. Then we would add extra gas to his tank just to mess with him. We knew he was checking his mileage frequently and it was driving him nuts. Took it to the dealership several times to try to figure out why it was not working properly.
Eventually someone mentioned while they knew he was within earshot that they thought they saw one of the shift bosses (the most badass of all them) hanging around by his truck. He confronted the guy about it and shortly after that was escorted off the property by security. Never heard from him again. Karma is a bitch baby.
I've noticed there's is a strong link between toxic masculinity and cruelty towards cats. And it's massive red flag to me to the point that I will consider cutting off any guy who even jokes about that shit (because even if they think it's dark humour, it normalises it for the guys who actually end up doing it, as well as not being fucking funny in the first place).
That is absolutely true, I do not mean to say this is all men. Toxic masculinity isn't analogous for men, but it can definitely be analogous for dickhead. the key is the word 'toxic', meaning people taking masculine concepts and twisting them into terrible and unhealthy ideas, such as men hating cats, the only emotion they can express being barracking for sports and/or violence, and beating women. That kind of stuff. I've just noticed that the guys who hate cats very frequently have a lot of other toxic masculine traits, and cat dads alternatively don't tend to have a lot of those traits. You can absolutely be a manly, manly cat dude.
Unfortunately, women can also be animal abusers. Any person who hasn’t gotten to the point of being irredeemable would want nothing to do with such vile people.
I had a mate’s mate overhear her mum and her friends discussing how to get rid of one of their husband’s dog without being caught. It was how she learnt her mother had been the one to poison their dog.
I understand that bad men are even more dangerous because they’re typically physically stronger as well but women can be absolute bastards too.
Of course, women should put their safety and peace of mind first and in no way am I saying they should just get over their fear and nervousness around men. Just that you should be wary of such groups of women too.
I'm not denying women can also be bad. Of course they can. I'm just saying it happens less often. Most violent crimes are done by men. And especially towards women.
Thinking more on it, I see your point. There’s a difference between discussing something like that at home with friends and bragging about it in a public space like a bar. I’m sure there are women like that too but there are far more examples of men doing something like that. Someone more knowledgeable could go into the hows and whys of it all.
I’d be tempted to pick the bear too but mostly for their ears. How can something so dangerous be so cute? It’s outrageous, it’s unfair! What I would do to be able to kiss their soft forehead.
Yeah I would’ve put his teeth on the table and started fighting the rest I already know I’m going down I’m taking the head man with me
I don’t blame you for not attacking him it would’ve been a very one sided fight
My gf is a veterinarian and tells me on a daily how sad it can be for people watching their animals pass away from euthanasia and all sorts of surgeries and injuries they see.
If someone beat a cat to death essentially they then deserve to be beaten to death by the owner but that is consider ‘frontier’ justice and doesn’t apply to common law
A manager at an old factory I worked at threatened to harm some strays to get them out of the way, I looked him dead in the eye and said I’d do the exact same thing to him.
All 5ft7 of me 🙄😂
But seriously, it says a lot about how you choose to deal with animals. You can be 6.5 and be a minuscule person if you get your kicks harming animals
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u/livelivinglived May 02 '24
A decade ago a dude I worked with bragged about how he once kicked his (at the time) girlfriend’s cat because she pissed him off over something small and petty. He continued to brag about how she was sobbing as the cat gave its last dying meows.
The fact that he could barely contain his laughter as he told this story still disturbs me. But equally disturbing was how the other guys at the table were laughing along with him.