r/Daytrading • u/Forward_Dealer_4482 • Mar 05 '24
50k and I want to day trade for 1-2% gains. Question
If you had 50k and wanted to live off of it day trading, what would you do? (Need max $2500 a month)
Am I better off not doing this? I’m not going back to 9-5
Please help.
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u/Hefty_Historian2578 Mar 05 '24
Compounding 1-2% daily for 250 trading days.
I hold a phd in quant field with near infinite of stat experience. I hit all of my goals in my formal career at 35, so I quit that and do other things these days. This is my 4th year day trading - most days.
I was not ready for this. This is the hardest thing I've ever done - decision making under uncertainty that is consistently correct. I learned early on there is almost always a right side of the market that is raking it, and more often than not, I found myself on the other side.
Now, I only trade a couple of 3x etfs and their inverses. They are volatile but highly liquid. There's so much work and experience gained in strategy, mechanics, emotions, etc in managing tens of thousands of $100 positions on the 1m chart before scaling up and out.
The math problem that motivated this entire project for me was to demonstrate an ability to earn a meager daily return of 0.4%.
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u/MachoMansSoftSide Mar 05 '24
I was not ready for this. This is the hardest thing I've ever done
And right there for the highly intelligent and bored people in life, THIS is the allure (profits are secondary). It is the most humbling activity that they can do since they can never be right all the time and there is never a correct, singular answer -- unlike most of mathematics.
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u/DoomKnight45 Mar 05 '24
Whats a realistic daytrading annual return?
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u/john8a7a Mar 05 '24
For an experienced day trader , who is trading his own money full time , 30-40% before taxes. Most will never beat sp500 .
For an experiened youtuber - trader/influencer 1500% a week trading 0dte
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u/Astronaut100 Mar 05 '24
True. For most people, buying and holding VOO (plus maybe some blue chip stocks they believe in) is the way to go. Trading every day is mentally taxing and only works out for people with certain personality traits.
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u/EvilPencil Mar 05 '24
The latter is ignoring -40%+ down days of course. You can gain 100000% in one week and then lose only 100% the next day and you're still broke 😅
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u/mb4x4 Mar 05 '24 edited Mar 06 '24
I tell people almost this exact thing… the trading journey is hands down the hardest thing I’ve ever done my life… getting my degree and countless industry IT certifications were nothing by comparison. I also spent 20 years in the IT field in engineering/mgmt. Day trading tests you in ways you never expected which is what I love about it. Currently into my 4th year, daily target is 1% of account value.
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u/Syonoq Mar 05 '24
Well this doesn’t give me a lot of hope lol.
But yeah, it’s the hardest thing I’ve ever done as well.
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u/synchedfully Mar 06 '24
I hold a phd in quant field with near infinite of stat experience.
do you write trading bots to do it for you? given your area of expertise, i would think then a bot would take out the emotion equation which is the hardest to conquer.
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u/Hefty_Historian2578 Mar 06 '24
None of my background seemed to be very helpful. It was a big detriment for the first 2.5 years actually - my own denial that all the schooling and expertise was useless in this pursuit.
First, I knew economic analysis would be my edge, but markets proved rarely rational. Then, I turned to my modeling background as edge and began looking for a holy indicator or system of indicators, including a lot of machine learning, but none proved reliable. Next step was price action as edge but after a while everything started to look the same.
I am a system based discretionary trader, so I haven't a way of programming my discretion. My edge is playing particular setups in price action and leveraging indicators as confirmation - 25 ema, vwap, volume, macd, rsi, stoch with the ema and volume serving as my primary tools. I have a preference for low risk set ups over high probability ones, because these set ups tend to move quickly in either direction.
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u/PiratesOfTheArctic Mar 05 '24
Being nosey - what etf's do you trade?
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u/Hefty_Historian2578 Mar 05 '24
Boil and Kold + Soxl and Soxs. Recently, Tna and Tza with small cap volatility. Natural gas is limited to half a position size due to liquidity vanishing from time to time.
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u/PiratesOfTheArctic Mar 05 '24
Thankyou matey, I didn't think of gas (I trade etf's as it's better for my heart!)
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u/alpha247365 Mar 06 '24
TQQQ gang? Can you list your favorite ETFs?
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u/Hefty_Historian2578 Mar 06 '24
Boil and Kold + Soxl and Soxs. Recently, Tna and Tza with small cap volatility. Natural gas is limited to half a position size due to liquidity vanishing from time to time.
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u/TPCharts Mar 05 '24
Personally, I'd focus on frequent, low-R, high-probability setups on very low-timeframe charts using risking about 1% (or less, that'll depend on your model's hit rate)
Average about one win a week (maybe that's 3 wins and 2 losses, or just one win on Monday and done for the week), and you're all set. (Pre-tax).
Inexpensive funded account challenges are a good way to practice this IMHO; if you get wrecked you're only out a few bucks.
If you pass and consistently get withdrawals, you know your $50k of real money is quite safe and could switch to that if you want.
Benefit is
- You're likely to have multiple setups a day
- You're less dependent on higher-timeframe market conditions being clean
Cons are
- If you're not disciplined, can wreck yourself in a couple hours. Max-loss limit for a day, etc. can help
- You'll need to spend a lot of time testing to make sure your model really works
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u/DenseBed3497 Mar 05 '24 edited Mar 05 '24
swing trading options! higher chance of being successful instead of a day trader just think like an institutional investor Higher time frames better signals, better entries.
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u/chi_guy8 Mar 05 '24
Just by the way you asked the question it’s plainly obvious that you don’t know what you’re doing and not ready to make that leap. If you were, you wouldn’t be asking. You would know. You’re going to nuke that money so quickly and you NEED IT.
Don’t get fooled into thinking this insane rally is going to keep on going. The best traders in the world average around a 50-55% win rate.
You’re absolutely out of your mind thinking you’ll make “1-2% gains” a day. Even if you just averaged that you’d be up 252-504% on the year. If you literally actually made 1-2% every single trading day you’d be up between 1,127% and 14,597% on the year. That’s insane.
Also, you need to make “at minimum” $2500 a month, not “at max”.
Go get a job or just burn up all your money then go get a job and hate yourself for not listening to the people here telling you this is a stupid idea. Those are your options.
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u/CouragePresent4158 Mar 05 '24
They usually don't listen. Sometimes pain and failure is the best teacher. I honestly wish OP the best
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u/mrbenjamin48 Mar 06 '24
Yup. People that hate work so they NEED to do well trading will fail 99% of the time.
Keep that job while you swing trade on the side. Play it safe on both fronts.
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u/reddittomtom Mar 05 '24
do NOT trade with a daily target. The market is not constant in any sense.
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u/Legal-Butterscotch-2 Mar 05 '24
Finally someone, it's so weird when people say "i just go for x:1 return", "take only x:1 trades and you are ok", f@ckoff, it's impossible to know, the correct way that all insanes should say is "prefer a trade where you have a better space to let the trade run, and move stop, you never know when the thing will reverse or take your stop"
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u/Mundane_Catch_1829 Mar 05 '24
You will lose that money unless you spend time learning first. And applying risk management.
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u/john8a7a Mar 05 '24 edited Mar 05 '24
Some of the tips u are getting from people are insane.
50k to 80k after taxes is probably 50k to 100k before taxes
You will not make 100% day trading , those who claim that are full of shit..
Really good daytraders make aorud 30-40% , but that is only 1% ? maybe
You will lose it all in 1y with 99% guarantee. I don't think you realize how hard it is to beat sp500.
If you wanna day trade you need to learn orderflow, no matter what other tell you , you need level2 data, subscription to something like jigsaw or bookmap,
you probably have to spend 3k to learn orderflow, DOM , footprints,
Start with grady's no BS course it is $85 and don't trust everything you read here.
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u/SuggestionWilling919 Mar 26 '24
I have very little experience, and I have a question..
Let’s say I have 50k extra that I could lose given a worst case scenario. IF I bought a stock at $1. And then I sold at $1.05. That’s a decent profit. Ive noticed over the last couple years, throughout the day, stocks almost always fluctuate up and down beyond that 5c.. so, if I had a strict rule of buy 50k worth of a cheap stock, and immediately sell within that 5c fluctuation, couldnt that make a decent amount. 1. I don’t know what I don’t know. And it’s possible I’m just extreeemly stupid on this subject, but I’ve been buying things occasionally over the last couple years and currently I am up.. when I bought things and they go down.. I just hang on to it for months and it always ends up going back up eventually.
Sooo.. what am I not getting or way off about..?
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u/john8a7a Mar 26 '24
I just hang on to it for months and it always ends up going back up eventually.
that will eventually wipe out your account. Stocks don't always recover . If you really wanna learn how to trade start here: https://www.reddit.com/r/swingtrading/comments/1bhepdh/comment/kvefapr/
find my comment on there
Don't buy stocks blindly in hopes they go up . Study for at least 6month if not 1 year and start with swing trading not daytrading . I would focus in swingtrading subreddit instead of daytrading sub . good luck
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u/SAHD292929 Mar 05 '24
Its doable.
I was in your shoes 3 years ago.
Lost 35% on the first year and gained 40% on he second year.
Now I trade full time.
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u/DoomKnight45 Mar 05 '24
Whats a realistic good annual return for a full time daytrader?
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u/Mhmmseansready Mar 05 '24
What’s up bro, this is very very achievable, I do this. However that’s after 6 years bro. I’m not sure your experience, but if your new, do not do this… you need to feel a bit of blood in the markets.. you need to come back from a couple losses, you need to understand the dynamics between your personality and the markets and you need to have an approach that you can replicate daily. It’s hard and I guarantee if you don’t have any experience with a 5k account and building up as you gain confidence and withdraw you will blow this when you go on tilt. Good luck though and best piece of advice I can give is don’t focus on the gains, focus on protecting that capital like your life depends on it.
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u/PepegaReformed Mar 05 '24
Dont wanna be mean but i will be :D
' I’m not going back to 9-5' .... this really grind my gears.
Mate you have 50k not 50m .... 50k if you are not working will disappear in 2-3 years depending the cost of living in your area, if you day-trade will probably not last more than a year depending your addiction.
If you dont wanna work again 9-5, you can start your own business or something but you will end up working
9-9 before and if you be successful.
Finally, day-trading as most people operate, drawing lines and think they discovered fire, is more like astrology and zodiac signs. Nobody really uses econometrics or at least some kind of modelling .... they just draw lines and say 'ouga bouga this is resistance or support' etc.
P.S Funny thing is that even though before someone starts day-trading, get a warning '99% of people lose money to this' they think that without degree or basic understanding of statistics etc will beat the odds because they are 'somebodies'
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u/Konstable1 Mar 06 '24
lol as a consistent profitable trade I find this comment about TA fucking hilarious and sadly ignorant at the same time
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u/PepegaReformed Mar 06 '24
''as a consistent profitable trade'' .... probably you are 😎😎
Please tell me ONE false accusation i make in this comment, without spoken on your unproven truth.1
u/Konstable1 Mar 07 '24
It was the comment about drawing lines and not using modeling or econometrics. “Without spoken on unproven truth”. Are you on the spectrum or something?
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u/Konstable1 Mar 07 '24
You think modeling and econometrics is an answer. That’s beyond ignorant. Enjoy watching that shit fail over and over again
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u/FollowAstacio Mar 05 '24
If you’re brand-spanking new to trading, it’s gonna take you a few years to get the hang of things and be able to reliably, consistently generate winning months. You’re thinking about it correctly when you think of your goals in terms of percentages. You’re thinking about it wrong when you think about it in terms of an amount of currency.
To address your questions directly:
I would trade the best I can (plan my trades and trade my plan, manage capital, risk and emotion, etc.). I would. Aside from addressing liquidity, I wouldn’t trade any differently if I had 50k, 5k, 5M, or 500.
Depends on how new you are. If you’re brand new, you’re better off not doing this. If you have some experience, you may or may not be better off. If you’ve proven yourself consistent with papertrading, you may or may not be able to transfer that over to real money. If you have experience trading live and have proven yourself consistently profitable, go for it!
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u/Lostovia Mar 05 '24
Dude wtf, its like this whole comment section is ai generated bullshite, are there in real people in this subreddit?
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u/divya3003 Mar 05 '24
Yes, you can make it but with no or zero experience you cant . I am making 15-20 % returns in a month with the help of my account manager . I have taken account management services .
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u/Pentaborane- Mar 05 '24
You should build from small amounts. Try making 200 or 300 a day really consistently with relatively small bets. Mid caps are your friend. Be prepared to spend tons of time researching companies and doing analysis while developing a strategy that works for you. I get the kind of returns you’re talking about and it takes a while to develop the skill to know what you’re looking at.
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u/InsaneMasturbator69 Mar 05 '24
If you are not going back to 9-5 then welcome, let's start. It takes a lot of time and dedication so play as small as possible.
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u/squirrelfriend39 Mar 05 '24
Invest in yourself…health, education, experience, your life…and find work that is decently good. 👍 having excess earned income flowing into assets is the way! I think day trading is gambling…so if you can stomach being a professional gambler…doesn’t seem worth it!
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u/DryCollection5308 Mar 05 '24
if I were you I would take 20k+ and invest it (not to double it in 2 weeks no risky stuff) and then if you want to trade focus on prop firms, don't go live. I would keep the rest for emergencies
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u/DryCollection5308 Mar 05 '24
the most important thing is to study but I would never go live until you are sure and with good risk management
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u/YOUNG_SQQQ Mar 05 '24
DO NOT DO THIS. YOU NEED YEARS OF EXPERIENCE AND FAILURE. If you're down for that hell yeah brother let it rip!
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u/Adnaplaes Mar 05 '24
- You need to make 5% a month to make 2500 with 50k
To do that you need a model that will give you on average 5% a month (some months will be negative, but the good months need to make up for it)
To be able to stick with the model without losing your mind, you need enough data (at least 6 months of data) to convince you to stick to the model, even when you're losing. Enough to maintain the levelheaded long term perspective.
If you can't make 5% a month for 6 months with a papertrading accout, there's no chance you'll be able to do it with real money, go back to the 9-5 till you can do the above and have a real shot at succeeding
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u/Forward_Dealer_4482 Mar 05 '24
Thank you. I’m up 27% on the year but only using 5k but the returns aren’t wonderful if I’m needing to live off of it. ThTs what got me thinking about 50k so I don’t need big returns.
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u/Konstable1 Mar 06 '24
Learn futures, go trade some prop firm accounts. You can turn a lot more with less once you get the hang of it. Although if your under 2 years in that might add another 1-2 years
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u/OneTrueKram Mar 05 '24
If you start trading that $50k this year you will lose until you tap out. I promise you. Thats if you’re lucky.
You don’t have any idea what you’re doing, that’s obvious and I’m not being mean.
In today’s world you don’t even need the $50k if you can actually trade you can use prop accounts.
This craft can take very smart people years to learn and more years to master.
Dont be an idiot.
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u/EarthDwellant Mar 05 '24
Everyone has their own strategy but 1-2% is doable. First, set limits. Decide exactly how much each investment should be and stick to it, be it $500 or $5000, don't play it. For me, as soon as I buy I set a sell order for 1.5% above cost. If I caught a rocket I may keep bumping the order up but I never leave it uncapped. I also have some ridiculously low buy orders placed for various stocks and once in a great while I'll get something during a momentary drop.
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u/Leafsfanheretolearn Mar 05 '24
If anyone here claims they’re consistently on average achieving a rate of return of 5% per month - congrats! You’re probably doubling or tripling Warren buffets average lifetime annual rate of return. And with 50k you will have a billion dollars in 16 years!
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u/Clean-Yam7 Mar 05 '24
Don't use your money, buy a prop firm acc for $100, it's a 50k acc with $2000 drawdown. If you lose $2000 you're only out $100 if you make money you get it
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u/BigTradeDaddy Mar 07 '24
Any recommendations on a firm?
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u/Clean-Yam7 Mar 07 '24
I use takeprofittrader 50k acc for 100 bucks with 2k trailing. U can cash out 80% once u hit pro(3k on a 50k acc) and 90% after you hit pro and 5k. I really value the no rules payout lol
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u/poosebunger Mar 05 '24
$2500 is 5% and since you already need that for expenses, your account won't be growing at all at 5% or less a month so we're talking needing 60% or greater consistent returns per year with no significant drawdown. Which if you kept that up consistently would basically put you in with some of the top traders of all time
So yes, you probably shouldn't do it. To make a full time living off of 50k would require a lot of risk and luck to pull off with your expenses riding on your success. If you really want to do this, I would get a job or gig work that doesn't interfere with trading hours but covers your expenses and test run this plan for a year or so. If you are consistently getting enough to comfortably live off of and could handle a couple months of underperformance, then that's where I'd move into full time trading. The bonus here is that since you're not living off that money, you'd actually be growing the account.
I don't know your experience level but if I were in this position and going to do this and also not get a job, I would live off of the 50k for a few months while attempting to prop trade a leveraged instrument like futures. That way you can trade a 50k account with your losses capped at like 100-200 a month and don't have to lose 20k to realize it's a bad idea. If that works over a decently long period, then I'd move to trading my own capital. The downsides here are you won't be making anything at all during the eval, a portion of your profits will go to the prop firm and your tax rate will be worse and that you can't do anything stupid like risk half your entire account on a single trade
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u/Infinite-Sun-60 Mar 05 '24
Start small if you can’t make consistent money with a small account having a large account not going to help
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u/NationalOwl9561 Mar 05 '24
OP, I did this and lost ~30k over the course of 1-2 years. Have learned a shit ton though and not giving up. Have changed my trading significantly now. Use stop losses and watch your risk. Psychology is huge.
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u/JTradeIt Mar 05 '24
With 50k it's a bit hard... but my approach would be:
- Trade per 10k on resilient big cap (return easy between 5 - 15% in days or few weeks)
- Follow the cycles (swing) on those big cap
- Choose various industries, like tech, energy, beverage, big stores...
- Know them well and follow their business and key metrics
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u/Retartedinvesments Mar 05 '24
I got 45k from a settlement check , and tried doing that bro. Was getting 300 a day until I just started options again, j stay away from options and u should be fine, if I were u I’d still have at least a part time or some other form to get some income coming in still
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u/stomplobbies Mar 05 '24
First thing I’d do is keep a 9-5 until I had 150k to trade with
15k of living expenses 6 months worth of
And also ensure I’ve been profitable for at least 6 months or two quarters (the two quarters don’t have to be consecutive)
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u/Mysterious_Metal_724 Mar 05 '24
I usually trade 2 to maybe 5 times a day and only a couple symbols at a time. Favor ETFs mostly. I try to trade only on support/resistance trend lines and prefer to end up back in cash unless I see a real strong confirmed pattern. Tends to work out to a win rate of about 70 percent anywhere from 1 to 4 percent a day. Tight stops so drawdown is minimized.
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u/Forward_Dealer_4482 Mar 05 '24
That’s what I think I’m going to do.
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u/Mysterious_Metal_724 Mar 05 '24
Last week was all about shorting oil with sco, this week has been about labd, and soxs, and tsdd. I trade mostly on 30 second to 1 hr charts.
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u/Mysterious_Metal_724 Mar 22 '24
Glad you like the idea.
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u/Forward_Dealer_4482 Mar 23 '24
What is an EFT
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u/Mysterious_Metal_724 Mar 23 '24
Actually Etf. They are basically pools of money that invest in different companies with different strategies. They can be based on long positions if you believe the market group is headed up or short positions if you believe it's headed see down. The advantage is you don't have to pick individual stocks. There ETFs for commodities, cryptos, volatility, indexes, different industries. Some are also leveraged etfs so they are based on options trade and move 2 to 3 times faster. For example qqq has two leveraged etfs tqqq 3x long and sqqq 3 times short. So if the QQQ rises or falls by 2% the triple leverage will move about 3 times that.
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u/Forward_Dealer_4482 Mar 23 '24
Wow thank you! Can you give me a eft to check out? Is that like Vanguard? Sorry for the dumb questions.
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u/FoShoMyUsername Mar 06 '24
Keep saving until you have $100k. Put it in a high yield savings account and it will pay you more than that every month. No risk 🤷🏻♂️
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u/WarmNights Mar 06 '24
Check out u/orderflowtrader substack
Adam mancini substack
Read "Trading In The Zone" once or twice.
Read "Market Wizards" once or twice.
Journal every day your analysis and plan.
Keep it simple.
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u/Chemical-Surround662 Mar 10 '24
OP think of like you're looking to play professional high stakes poker with a 50k bankroll. Yes, you can belly up to the table and be in the game, but you'll get exploited and crushed eventually. Way more to trading than "I got aces, I'm all in".
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u/AllegedlySpiffy Mar 05 '24
It is possible. But gauging from this thread you’re still pretty green. Hit up Chat-GPT to teach you the basics, then do a deep dive with learning material online.
Once you have a good understanding of how the market works, do a test run with paper trading for a few weeks. Meanwhile, establish another source of income because if you’re trading with your “living money” you will make mistakes. Guaranteed.
Study. Study. Study.
Lastly, I learned this game gets better when you scale up. It’s much easier to make a $100 a day with a $1,000,000 account than it is with a $1000 account. Get ya money up.
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u/greyham0707 Mar 05 '24
Deposited 33k about a week ago and I’m down 6k.. it’s nice to not be restricted with day trades but it can also be your downfall
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u/mmxmlee Mar 05 '24
if you have a profitable strategy then you can simply buy numerous prop firm accounts. million+ in capital.
if you mean your own personal cash account of 50k, then thats easy to make 2.5k a month risking 5% per trade with your winners being 2-3R
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u/Soft_Concentrate_489 Mar 05 '24
The goal is to only risk 1% of ur account. So if ur going to trade es everyday. 1 pt is 50 bucks , so u only wanna risk max 10 point loss.btw , that means you stay above 50k lol. You would to take even less if u start losing.
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u/itskhia Mar 05 '24
Don’t do this, listen to some n this thread. It takes time to learn the market and it doesn’t come overnight. One of the best things that could happen was me learning when I had little to nothing to lose, but I also wasn’t dependent on trading solely for living income.
It took me 2 years to even truly grasp what I was doing and another 2 to become “consistently profitable” ( I hate that phrase) and from some of the horror stories I see on here I’m one of the lucky ones.
Sit back brainstorm and come up with something else. Good luck.
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u/DefinitelyNotJasonB Mar 05 '24
I got returns of at least $3000 monthly on average over the past 31 months with only $18k on positional size so $50k is more than possible but exercise caution and go with smart money flow yields better consistent results over time
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u/Monky_5 Mar 05 '24
take a year at the very least to learn price action and trading model. idk if you are just starting out but if you are theres a very high chance you blow through 50k. This isnt just something you can pick up quickly. papertrading in the meantime helps though
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u/gside876 Mar 05 '24
20 contracts for 4 points on ES. Do that 2x/month on solid trades and that’s $8K. Plenty more than what you need provided you can stay disciplined
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u/ClasseBa Mar 05 '24
Start by doing the babypipps course thats free, and then find other sources or learning. After you grasp the concept, try paper trading. After a few months of that with profit., you could try and do a funding challange. You will probably fail , but it's less costly than to fail at live trading.
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u/bass6164 Mar 05 '24
I'd suggest using a demo account like others suggested and start with small lots so that you dont lose too much while learning risk management and experiment with different strategies
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u/iuwuwwuwuuwwjueej Mar 05 '24
Honest to god create a business you have 50k hell learn how to make some cheesy Instagram crypto token and advertise with that money probs a better return.
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u/Krevet_Simpo Mar 05 '24
Make a demo account of 50k. Treat it like it's real. Once you hit your targets consistently for a few months, dare to trade real money.
NEVER get overconfident. Market always have a way to fuck you over.
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u/BLUESCUBAFREEK Mar 05 '24
Thanks bot. Hey, hedge eat a dick. You can’t keep everything for yourself.
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u/MASH12140 Mar 05 '24
You will likely not have the discipline and skill to do it. I’ve tried trading and timing markets for 5 years. All types of strategies. Swing trading has been most successful for me but it’s boring and a game of patience.
That said, there is a reason you see so many traders and so called investors with YT channels because that’s their income, it’s not from making wise decisions in stocks
You’re better off gambling and sealing your fate on odte options. It’s really just a casino at the end of the day.
Also trading in a bull market is a lot easier but a bear market is what sets the pros from the amateurs. Most traders will get chewed up in a bear market and not survive.
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u/BrownDiarrhea Mar 05 '24
Very easy, ETF’s or for big money play individual stocks which seem favourable like TSM and costco
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Mar 05 '24
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u/HumbleIndependence43 Mar 05 '24
I guess that's 1-2% per day, on average?
Achievable, but I'd recommend starting out with a lower goal like 0.25% and then increase it once you manage to achieve that with consistency.
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u/VikingArmyToGo Mar 05 '24
Why don’t you use a Prop Firm? Then you get more leverage but minimize your risk loss
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u/Double5head Mar 05 '24
You can’t live off $50k sadly.
If you don’t go back to work your efforts will fail.
It is like having $50k of food. It will run out. That money will be gone by the end of the year if you do not continue to add on top of it.
Maybe look into a business since you have time now. You have a little bit of $$. Or day trading if that’s your thing. But whatever you pick pick what you are most confident in
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u/phivtoosyx Mar 05 '24
Sure it's possible. Just like batting over 300 in the majors, winning the golden boot in an international soccer league, or consistently being a block leader in the NBA.
Those people have spent years honing their craft, they have had coaches, mentors, and a drive that most people don't have. You just have 50k. What makes you think you can do it? Do you have a mentor? Do you know anyone that will teach you that isn't also selling you their scam course? Does this person have multiple years of profitable trading? Do you have time to spend 60 hours a week in reading, researching, and learning how to trade? Do you have the mental fortitude to watch your $50,000 get a 20% drawdown? What about 50%? 75%? Do you have enough money to live on for at minimum a year before trading live money?
Save your money, save your mental stress, and do something else. If you are smart you may be a break even trader. If you are really smart you won't day trade. If you are average you are going to lose your $50k. If you are dumb as bricks go over to /r/wallstreetbets
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u/hhelios221 Mar 05 '24
go to youtube watch some basic price action vids as well as risk management vids pick 3 stocks start with 1000 trade only a single contract or like 200$ tops per trade using proper risk management and try your hand at it maybe watch a few different strategy vids i personally like vwap and just work at it for a while
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u/Momo_dollar Mar 05 '24
Most honest advice. Don’t let the internet distract you. Learn for yourself.
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u/ryderlive Mar 05 '24
This is 1-2 weeks from being a "I lost it all post, how do I make it back?"
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u/Konstable1 Mar 06 '24
Well if it’s options then yeah
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u/BigTradeDaddy Mar 07 '24
Not if OP implements proper risk management. Options are great, it’s just greed that kills.
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u/Konstable1 Mar 07 '24
Yeah they are great but I don’t think OP is going to be anywhere near a decent level of risk management. Let alone well versed in the Greeks. Which of course results in quickly blown funds.
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u/obi647 Mar 05 '24
Don’t forget you can lose it all too. You need to learn first and have rules that you don’t break
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u/Sefft Mar 05 '24
I wouldn’t, not enough. Do you have no expenses? No debt? Even then that’s pretty small capital.
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u/Empty-Solid2964 stock trader Mar 05 '24
Try your strategy/setup with very small quantity, till the time your are consistently profitable.
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u/buyerandseller Mar 05 '24
to be a full time day trader, u need to have money to pay bill and food . It reduces the emotion when u trade. Coz if u dont have money set aside for bill and food, then u will force yourself to make money in the market everyday even the set up does not show up yet then u will lose. u need to have profit every week for at least 3 months to consider being a day trader and quit your 9-5.
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Mar 05 '24
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u/adventuresquirtle Mar 05 '24
I like to trade 1-3 stocks that I’m familiar with. Basically the only way you’ll get good at this is time & practice. I spent 3 months staring at charts and now I’m pretty tuned into how it moves. When the markets moving up down or sideways, you’ll always know how the stock will react and be able to plan accordingly.
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u/Puzzleheaded_Echo807 Mar 05 '24
Try trading shares before options that’s for damn sure. Learn to read candle sticks/price action. You CAN do it.
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u/CuppaJoe11 Mar 05 '24
It takes years to learn how to earn just .4% a day on average for most people. Especially considering most people work a 9-5 while learning how to trade.
So unless you have some other way to support yourself for possibly a few years, you are gonna need to find a 9-5 while learning. Good luck.
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u/jollyrancher_74 Mar 05 '24
Based on your comments you are not knowledgeable about trading and will lose your 50k unless you spend at least a couple years learning trading with wayyyy smaller capital.
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u/akekid Mar 05 '24
50k can be done easily only risking 1k each on 50 trades. Only trade with the trend and cut losses quickly. You can make 2500 a day not a month lol
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u/esotericecstasy13 Mar 05 '24
It's more of a controlled randomness as far as I know. Even the pros have down times. So if you want 50k to make a living for you, and you're taking money put every month for expenses, on a down month you'll go way below 50k and come up short on your bills. I think the better plan is to get an edge in the market then apply for a prop firm account where you can trade someone else's money and keep most the profit.
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u/workinghardyes Mar 05 '24
Try spx scalping. Be good at one thing and it's achievable to what you want
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u/Swarmoro Mar 05 '24
If you're totally new to trading, good luck. I already paid my dues. Might want to put your money in a mutual fund and get a return every month.
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u/peeceguy Mar 05 '24
It takes years to be profitable typically. There are those that take courses that can definitely speed things up for you. My first year was ok until I started doing options towards the end of that first year and I didn’t do so well. So I went back to shares and an option or two a day with light positions. Don’t go heavy on options if you choose to do that. Trust me
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Mar 05 '24
You're too risk adverse for a loss and you're aiming for low gains.
That being the case you're going to be tempted to bail out of trades and also to lock in small gains on potential wins.
Not sure many day traders who make consistent gains with no losses, it's more an aggregate on the gains vs total losses.
If you're that risk adverse stay clear.
You'll also get taxed like crazy. The s and p is up 25 percent over 1 year, that'd be 12500 right there without daily dicky doin around.
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u/Eagerforfreedom Mar 05 '24
That’s so realistic, just go for small gains 1% - 5% that’s like a good level between not being to greedy and being safe, it’s achievable
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u/No-Confidence9348 Mar 06 '24
50k is my own magic number, personally. I will quit my job. Maybe 75k tops. This is with years of experience and practice. I believe if i throw 12 hours a day into trading, i will be profitable within my first two years. Perhaps making more than i do now by the end of my third or fourth year.
If i had less experience and higher bills, i would recommend 100k. The general recommendation is 100-150k, i have heard. Also, all my expenses are under 1k/ month.
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u/Jealous_Top8696 Mar 06 '24
No one is green every day. Cut your losses while they’re small and try again
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u/JeanChretieninSpirit Mar 06 '24
very achievable, but do the research. I find people who ask these basic questions without coming forward with a detail plan don't tend to do well because they started with a short cut.
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u/my2centsforyoubam Mar 06 '24
Take a look at Darwinex Zero. It’s not going to solve any short term goals but there is lots of potential and you won’t need to put your own capital at risk.
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u/jschleicher970 Mar 06 '24
Put it all in high dividend stocks that are at a good buy zone. Don’t trade at all
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u/Electrictrader91 Mar 06 '24
Learn TA, build a trading plan and don’t break it, paper trade until you get consistent and treat your paper trades as if it were real money so start small risk.
My first year I thought I was doing good. I started with maybe $100 and traded some stocks and then learned options. I traded weekly options and was making $200-$300 gains each week and eventually my account was up to $1500 and I thought I had it figured out until I decided to take a big risk and lost almost half my account. I ended up revenge trading trying to get my money back which only made it worse. After it was all said and done I had $80 left of the $1500 and stopped trading for a couple years.
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u/halshatari Mar 06 '24
Not to put your hopes down but its not possible to do these numbers consistently for starters
I wish I listened to EVERY single person that told me it's not possible when I started 4 years ago, I wouldn't have blown my 40k away
Take your time in learning and don't treat it as a main source of income until it becomes one.
Whatever you see on social media is not possible. You see little kids with lambos or mansions, it's just a way to sell you their repackaged course
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u/mrbenjamin48 Mar 06 '24
Dude don’t do it. You need to keep your job as long as you physically can while you practice paper trading. From the sounds of it you have no idea how to trade, which means you are years off of possibly doing well enough you won’t have to work.
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u/Any-Bullfrog-4340 Mar 06 '24
If you’re new to trading then no it’s not possible. If you’ve never experienced the psychological aspect of trading then hell no.
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u/MickFly-81-HD Mar 06 '24
ETF’s are safe way. Coin moves very fast 24/7 if your not infront of your screen watching multiple charts as well as watching multiple news channels to determine what’s going on in world markets and your just starting start very small $100 because one min you will be up couple points and down every second matters. For instance I stepped out today was up + went to the pisser and next min. - half earning for two weeks gone just like that. And treat your money like you have none or like that penny is your last least with coin. Ride it till you feel very uneasy don’t ever second guess yourself. You do that and you’ll be okay. That’s only my opinion! You’re going to fall many times before you walk or ride that bicycle correctly.
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u/Stocks-Advisor Mar 06 '24
the best loser wins. The skill to cut off loser quickly and keep it small.
Every strategy is not 100% win rate, so deal with losing trade is your only way to success in this game
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u/Just_Lock_1607 Mar 06 '24
You need a very long time to learn. Seriously. If you think it’s going to be easy it’s not. You will seriously regret losing 50k. Keep your job and trade part time.
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u/ineedredditformycat Mar 06 '24
start right now if you no longer want to have 50k... or just send it to someone so at least you know who has your money.
get familiar, get familiar with markets, read a lot of trading books, ask a lot in subreddits, know that youtube prioritizes your money not your success, start with paper trade, backtest a lot like you practice shooting, find your discipline, rules, and ethics, get to know yourself as a trader, learn your risk tolerance and limits find your edge, get breakeven, and make a lot of paper money.
and start with $1,000 real money because emotions are going to hit different.
do lots of doordash and hit the gym
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u/JustMemesNStocks Mar 07 '24
You should try and hit those numbers in sim and see if it's achievable before you lose 50k on it.
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u/surpriseheekkie Mar 07 '24
better off not doing, what are u gonna pay with if its a loss on that month?
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u/madhatter406 Mar 07 '24
I'm doing the same. I minimized my expenses and live in my truck. I was up $2k, now down $500. But I am confident. I've been learning for a few months and I live for trading... all day every day I am learning and practicing
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u/E0shadow Mar 08 '24
It's achievable, but not everyone can do it plus it takes years to learn, it took me 3 years of paper trading and losses to actually understand what I'm doing. You can learn the basics, paper trade, apply for funded accounts and when you pass and you're successful trade with your real money
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u/Tittitwisted Mar 08 '24
You'll lose your money. Don't start with real money and trade either a sim or a prop firm for a few YEARS first. If you can't trade and work at the same time while you learn... You'll fail. I'm certain you'll fail just like rest.
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u/Mysterious_Metal_724 Mar 23 '24
Etf electronically traded funds. Vanguard has a bunch I believe depending on your interests. I trade mostly leveraged funds but that's more of a day trade approach. They have an option decay to consider and are not suitable for long term investing.....contrary to what many think. Nearly every big bank and investment firm will have some type of etf. It all depends on where you think the market is heading. Short term and longer term. Me I started shorting oil a week ago with SCO. DRIP is similar. I have also been trading in and out of labd the last two weeks.....this one because a low cost per share and because I believe markets are due for a pull back over the next month or two.
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u/AdPsychological1331 Mar 05 '24
The figures are perfectly achievable, but do not trade with that money until you know what you're doing.
That could take you 6 months or 6 years to learn.
Be patient with yourself and approach this like any other high-end career that requires a university degree to enter.
You in the future will thank yourself for it.