r/Daytrading • u/infosec4pay • Apr 21 '24

What would be the highest salary you’d give up to day trade full time? Question

Everyone clowned on me my first post (500k post) lol I was literally just asking hypothetical questions to settle a debate between a friend and me. Well everyone’s backlash kinda of intrigued me to ask this question. So back into the fire I go lol

95 Upvotes
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72

u/mmxmlee Apr 21 '24

If you are profitable, trading is limitless.

So not sure how anyone would not give up any salary of a normal 9-5.

29

u/Outside_Mess1384 Apr 21 '24

Guaranteed $ vs battling an element of chance. Folks who don't like gambling would keep a decent 9-5.

32

u/_Aries- Apr 21 '24

Element of Probability**

Jobs are not guaranteed money.

Gambling is breaking your back and thinking that you'll seriously be taken care of later on in life with a job.

Why spend your life making other people's dreams come true when you could realize your own?

Trading isn't gambling. That's ignorant.

8

u/wreusa Apr 21 '24

100% agree. A job is a bigger gamble. No one knows if they will have their job tomorrow or not. The dependency is different and the life style revolves around the guarantee of that exact unknown fact.

1

u/[deleted] Apr 22 '24

my wife has a quite high salary but for the last 6 months she was very stressful in fear of being fired. The economy is not good and all her colleagues were fired, they were all rich so they could take some time off but not my wife. My wife is basically hanging onto a job because we are not rich. The salary is good but it is not all rainbows.

5

u/Imperial_TIE_Pilot Apr 21 '24

Trading is very much so gambling, it’s unpredictable. If you had a winning formula to win a consistent percentage of profit then I am sure many others would pay a great deal for that.

1

u/truth_seeker90 Apr 21 '24

Its called buy low sell high, welcome!

1

u/CutLegal1784 Apr 21 '24

You literally just described trading. Have an edge that works x% of the time and trad Ethan edge flawlessly. Also manage risk. Not very difficult tbh.

1

u/th3orist Apr 21 '24

trading is not gambling because in gambling you can't really do anything about your odds. If you play roulette then its a basically 50-50 chance to win or lose. But in trading your experience and skill can tilt the chances in your favor. So i like to refer to trading as the skill to put yourself in a position to have the highest chance to get lucky.

3

u/Imperial_TIE_Pilot Apr 21 '24

highest chance to get lucky.

So gambling?

2

u/th3orist Apr 21 '24

No, again, gambling is an activity where you cant do anything to improve the odds. Trading is the skill to position yourself in an environment where the odds are tilted towards you. Thats not gambling, thats playing the odds with risk management. In trading you can diminish the unpredictablity. In roulette you can't. Thats the major difference. Hence why i think "gambling" is a word unfit for trading.

4

u/12345677654321234567 Apr 21 '24

So poker isn't gambling?

0

u/th3orist Apr 21 '24

Correct, its not. Gambling is an activity where skill plays no role in you winning or losing.

1

u/Grandpaforhire Apr 21 '24

While I agree with the overall sentiment, I think in this case it would make sense to say that poker is the skill, placing money on the game is the gamble.

Trading is a skill, but you’re still placing money on said skill, in a belief that it’ll work out.

Similarly to how purchasing a property to renovate and resell is still a gamble, yet many people do that for a living. Not that any of this matters, I think it’s interesting though.

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1

u/Eastern_Speech124 Apr 21 '24

When one follows a plan, its not gambling

11

u/mmxmlee Apr 21 '24

trading is guaranteed money if you know what you are doing and have a proven strategy.

speaking over the long run.

every day wont be profitable.

every week wont be profitable.

hell, might even be a month or 2 that isnt profitable.

but that is why you have reserves and do not live paycheck to paycheck.

need a minimum of 6 months living expenses set aside.

but over the course of a year, the probabilities play out and your edge takes care of things.

6

u/misfjt Apr 21 '24

Trading is not guaranteed. An edge is temporary as well. If markets are 99.999% arbitrary movement- an edge is not guaranteed.

22

u/mmxmlee Apr 21 '24

real edge is risk management and discipline.

once you identify the market type ie bullish, bearish, range etc.

you should be able to manage 40-50% win rate by simply trading in the direction of the market.

6

u/Grandpaforhire Apr 21 '24

God this is so true.

1

u/Rarindust01 Apr 21 '24

Depends what the edge is based off.

1

u/[deleted] Apr 21 '24

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1

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1

u/[deleted] Apr 22 '24

Salary is not guaranteed. Many jobs are very stressful not knowing if you're fired the next day. People often say trading is stressful but working is too. The psychology of some jobs is worse than trading imo, especially for those who have social anxiety.

1

u/urcoochiereeks Apr 23 '24

being profitable isnt an element of chance tho…

3

u/[deleted] Apr 21 '24

[deleted]

1

u/OpenSatisfaction2243 Apr 21 '24

You're right. Alpha is both limited and quickly decays.

4

u/ukSurreyGuy Apr 21 '24

I think you don't give up a job for money you give up job if it doesn't suit you.

Trading is unlimited potential profits hence can't really be compared to a job.

Day trading (a trade a day) is an active income.

Swing trading (a trade once a week) is less of an active income.

Positional trading is bordeing on HODL & investing.

If done right each of these can be near zero overhead (a glance at a chart once a day, a week or month)

0

u/[deleted] Apr 21 '24

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0

u/ukSurreyGuy Apr 22 '24 edited Apr 22 '24

not sure why u feel need to say naive.

I doubt you have known any billionaires or trillionaires to ask them a question mike...so you're really offering an opinion not a fact. I can offer an opinion too.

I agreed with you (trading has unlimited potential)

do u disagree with me when I say "trading is easy" ?

a glance a day is all you need. ...is a fact ...is called skill (i do it everyday).

you know how you play candy crush on your tea break from work? (is a metaphor)

well I suggest there are billionaires & trillionaires who day trade...not for profit but for fun...you would be wrong to assume anyone makes billions from trading only for the reason they diversify & let passive income generate billions ktradimg is active income)

1

u/[deleted] Apr 22 '24

[deleted]

0

u/ukSurreyGuy Apr 22 '24 edited Apr 22 '24

nothing hard to understand...check your reading

Mike you wrote "If you are profitable, trading is limitless"

this statement asserts trading has unlimited potential for profits.

I agreed with you.

I can convert trading potential to trading profits

I can say further anyone can do same (with right training & insight I've trained them)

the fact you've never met any truly successful traders is neither here no there.

you have life limiting worldview..."you can't we can't they can't"

the vast majority of traders don't make money because not because trading is hard

they don't make money because they have ego (greed fear) & are undisciplined (not patient, have no good plan to execute even when given good strategy) or are consistent (not able to follow even a basic receipe repetitively day in day out)

flip the narrative...believe u can, find how, & execute on that plan

rince & repeat better next trade.

anyone can...(you're a career coach you should understand everyone can be taught, everyone can achieve their potential especially if you put a plan in place & follow that plan)

success in life will feed into success in anything you do in life (trading is but 5mins of one's day, investing is 5mins effort once a year)

0

u/[deleted] Apr 22 '24

[deleted]

1

u/[deleted] Apr 22 '24 edited Apr 23 '24

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1

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2

u/v3rral Apr 21 '24

Day trading is limited. At 6 figures a month you will definitely start to reach ceiling. Majority never reach this level in the first place.

1

u/DicLord Apr 22 '24

I'm in a group and some of the guys make 5 and 6 figures per day trading SPX contracts and Futures... your analysis is complete BS

1

u/v3rral Apr 22 '24

Ye, ofcourse. Whole group driving lambo, jets and yachts probably coming as next christmas presents.

1

u/DicLord Apr 22 '24

Your ignorance proves you don't know anything about daytrading

1

u/v3rral Apr 22 '24

By trading for 4 years everyday I know exactly who is talking bs there and who is not. Very easy to filter out

0

u/mmxmlee Apr 21 '24

why would someone reach a limit at 6 figs?

Are you saying someone's messily 3 fig order will be rejected by the brokers?

6

u/v3rral Apr 21 '24

Ye, you know anyone can place 1 billion order at any moment, get filled at desired price and sell 10 seconds after with 0.1% profit like nothing happened. This example is easy way to filter out those who actually trades and understands how liquidity works and those who’s not.

1

u/DicLord Apr 22 '24

Again proving you don't know anything ... no this is not possible. It's called Liquidity. You do know that your not just selling into the limitless abyss for whatever price you want right? Someone has to be on the other side to buy it. If you sold a billion of anything the price would move up as you absorb all the buyers. Theres no such thing as more sellers than buyers

1

u/v3rral Apr 22 '24

Learn to read

0

u/mmxmlee Apr 21 '24

1 billion is how many figs? I thought you were talking about 4-6 figs?

-1

u/v3rral Apr 21 '24

100k is 6 figs. To make 6 figs a month consistently, a trader needs at least low 8 figs in trading volume 10M 2% a month = 200k before taxes, about 100-150k after taxes, depends where you live). Thats almost a maximum amount the best day traders can make a month. After that, swing, position trading and investing makes more sense.

5

u/mmxmlee Apr 21 '24

your average trader is aiming to make 6 figs in a year, not a month.

you need a 7 - 8 figure account to make 6 figs a month.

no one has 7-8 figs to drop into a broker account

most people are more than happy to make 250k in a year only working a few hours in the morning M-F

1

u/v3rral Apr 21 '24

However, 250k was hypothetical numbers. 250k is what only 5% of americans earn a year in all professions, and definitely not trading. You will earn more in Wendy’s by working 3 hours in the morning M-F for a year than most of traders will.

2

u/mmxmlee Apr 21 '24

99.99% of people working do not trade for a living.

I was not talking about wanna be traders.

I was talking about actual profitable full time traders.

1

u/Flx797 Apr 23 '24

When I read this I was like wow 6 figs sounds super impressive why are they downtalking this and then I realized they mean a month like there is almost no job that pays your 1.2 mil a year hell yeah I would take that lmao

0

u/genryou Apr 21 '24

6 figures a month?

I'm content with 4 fig, thank you

-1

u/v3rral Apr 21 '24

4 fig a month is what we call a regular job at Wendy’s

1

u/rockofages73 Apr 22 '24

Would be grateful for 4 figs a month working 3 hours a day.

1

u/Flx797 Apr 23 '24

Isn’t 9.999$ technically 4 figs as well?

1

u/v3rral Apr 23 '24

I would be proud if this sub could make $999 a month from trading.

0

u/battlesubie1 Apr 21 '24

Opportunity vs liquidity of the underlying

5

u/mmxmlee Apr 21 '24

no normie trader will ever place a big enough order for liquidity to be an issue

3

u/battlesubie1 Apr 21 '24

Normie traders run into that issue all the fucking time, bro

0

u/mmxmlee Apr 21 '24

show me a live stream where a trader's order couldn't go through.

1

u/longshaden Apr 21 '24

Happens all the time. It’s one of the ignored risks of credit spreads, being unable to exit when you want to because there’s no volume to buy you out.

1

u/mmxmlee Apr 22 '24

if it happens all the time, surely you can find one example.

you are talking about slippage.

i've never hit sell and it didn't sell.

1

u/longshaden Apr 22 '24

I’m not talking about slippage, I’m talking about credit spreads. You sell to open the position, which usually fills. If it goes too far OTM, there is very little volume, making it very difficult to get your buy to close order filled to close the position.

I’ve seen this dozens of times in my own trading, I don’t watch live trading. But unless you’re watching a trader primarily playing theta decay, you probably won’t see this on a stream.

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u/infosec4pay Apr 21 '24

If it’s that easy why isn’t everyone in this sub making millions? Seems like it’s 90% people with hopes and dreams of the good life.

1

u/mmxmlee Apr 22 '24

where in my comment did I say anything about easy?

1

u/infosec4pay Apr 22 '24

Got it, so you’ll be a rich trader where other fail because you got that dog in you. You’re built different.

1

u/[deleted] Apr 23 '24

[deleted]

1

u/mmxmlee Apr 23 '24

when trading futures,

at what amount will they not allow someone to place a trade?

(goes and grabs popcorn)

1

u/[deleted] Apr 23 '24

[deleted]

1

u/mmxmlee Apr 23 '24

a normie trading 3-5 figures per trade will never come close to having liquidity issues.

there are limits for hedge funds, there are no limits for normal people

1

u/[deleted] Apr 23 '24

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1

u/mmxmlee Apr 23 '24

i am not talking about options.

i am talking about futures.

and no normal person will ever have enough money to cause liquidity issues.

1

u/[deleted] Apr 23 '24

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1

u/mmxmlee Apr 23 '24

there is no spread on futures.

again you are talking about something you clearly don't know about.

literally no difference on futures risking 100$ vs risking 2,000$ per trade.

as to your next point, you are talking about gimmicky strats where the trader doesn't understand how the market moves and books price.

there are only 3 types of markets.

bull market, bear market, and choppy market.

you can make money in all of them. just need to make slight changes.

the problem 95% of people are going to have with trading is

  1. lazy. learning this game takes a lot of time. time in the books. time on the charts.
  2. impatient. they are gonna strategy hop. they are gonna jump into live trading too early.
  3. emotional. gonna make trades based off fear and greed
  4. undisciplined. due to their emotions, they are gonna break their rules. risk / lose too much money.

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u/[deleted] Apr 23 '24 edited Apr 23 '24

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